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Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

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tobyp
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby tobyp on Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:58 pm

Intragration wrote:Thanks Driven! Toby, on the LCAs, are they internally braced for the sway bar? If so, if you wouldn't mind letting me know, I do have the word out on a few sets...



Yup, they are boxed in and braced. See pic.
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JRG53
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby JRG53 on Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:47 pm

Very nice! Motor looks sharp sittin' in there!

My first car (when I was 15!) was an '81 Cutlass with a Buick 455. Had so much fun in the car, but I had no gear in it! What I would give to have that car back, and with a different gear in it!

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finman04
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby finman04 on Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:19 pm

Great job Intagration, Nice job on your car. Three thumbs up!!! What motor mounts did you use, small block or big block mounts. Was wondering if you could post some pics of the headers on both sides of the motor especially the side where the header is over the frame. I also have been looking into the Hooker headers and the Dick Millers. but havent seen a set of the hookers on a car. The Miller headers are so expensive was looking at yours and they look great. Did you drop them in before you droped the block or after. How long did it take you to track down the 8.5. Been looking for awhile, are you keeping the 3.42 or are you going bigger. Again Great Job Looks Awesome.

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79loserbluebu
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby 79loserbluebu on Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:43 pm

Nice work, where in IL are you at?
79' Malibu
LQ4/4L60E/8.5
11 second full weight street car

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burgundy83
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby burgundy83 on Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:44 pm

I like the idea of a budget sleeper, that way it stays a sleeper, no hints or anything since it looks like a Cutlass rather than a race car. Same kind of idea I'm going for with my 4 door, but my wallet is scared of big blocks. Looking forward to what you do next.
--Milan
1983 Cutlass Supreme Brougham 4-door <--- For sale!

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Intragration
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby Intragration on Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:41 am

Thanks for the compliments guys. I'm in Northlake, just west of Chicago, where 290 and 294 meet. What about you 79?

Finman, I don't know if the Hookers are all that much cheaper than the Miller's, but I don't like mini-starters, and you need to run one with the Miller's, so the choice was made for me. As it turns out, the full-sized starter fits without any problem with the Hookers, you could change it without touching the headers. I hung the headers in their approximate position with coat hangers and dropped the motor on top of them. There was a slight interference on the passenger side putting the motor in, but once past this, it was easy. The frame mounts are your typical Oldsmobile ones. I've heard that the motor mounts themselves are different for 307s and 455s, I'm not sure about this. I went into O'Reilly's and asked for a set of motor mounts for a 1970 Olds 98, and that's what I installed. Lined right up, and as you can see, even with the Edelbrock Performer and the medium height air filter, it clears the stock hood.

I don't have any good pictures of the headers installed in the car, I'll try and get some for you. Here's what the headers look like, you can see the one primary that sort of loops out. I currently have very small tires on the car, but I don't have any issue with the turning radius. I park in a pretty tight garage downtown, and I think the furthest I've gone is 1 3/4 turns on the steering wheel either way, and they didn't hit. To keep from having a problem, I'll just put 215-65s on the front.

It took me almost no time to find the axle. The first and only cruise night I've taken the car to so far, a g-body buddy of mine mentioned he knew someone who had an axle, that's who I'm buying it from. You just have to put the feelers out, you'll find one. Toby might have an extra one. ;) I think eventually I'd like 3.08s, just for a slightly lower RPM on the highway, but 3.42 is close enough for now, and I have experience with a car in this range and it's not that bad, so it may work out. And if I drive 64 MPH with the 3.42s I'll be at the same RPM as 70 MPH with the 3.08s. Not a big deal to me.

Burgundy, big blocks don't really cost more than small blocks, and on the upside, you can spend a lot less on a big block, and you'll have a milder, more docile engine that makes as much or more power than a wilder small block. Plus, you get to say you have a big block. :) At this point, I am dying to get back to working on and driving the car. I'm glad I got it drivable before the winter, but then just when I was starting to have fun, the snow came. Next up is that axle, interior restoration, and some baseline runs at the track, in no particular order...
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Mike - 1983 Oldsmobile 455 Cutlass
My build thread http://www.gbodyforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=35347&hilit=sleeper+build
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burgundy83
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby burgundy83 on Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:03 am

Intragration wrote:Burgundy, big blocks don't really cost more than small blocks, and on the upside, you can spend a lot less on a big block, and you'll have a milder, more docile engine that makes as much or more power than a wilder small block. Plus, you get to say you have a big block. :)

I can see myself making so many mistakes with so much torque, that's all. I get all giddy :oops:
--Milan
1983 Cutlass Supreme Brougham 4-door <--- For sale!

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finman04
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby finman04 on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:17 pm

Hey Mike, Thanks for the pic of your headers, they look great. I really didnt want to use a min starter also. Thats great that you can remove the starter with the headers still on the car. I looked up the price on the hookers to the millers and wow, if i can save a few bucks i might just go with the alumium heads. The only thing with the millers is they fit within the frame. Since you went with the ceramic coating how was the breakin on the headers. Does the the oil filter clear the hooker headers without any problems. So you did buy the big block mounts, i also was reading that people say to use the small block frame and motor mounts. The only problem with this that the motor sits about 1" higher. I also see that you are using the clutch fan, i also have the clutch fan and was told it will run cooler with this. Have you had any cooling problems or did you change out your radiator also. Thanks for the pic

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Intragration
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby Intragration on Sat Mar 03, 2012 7:45 am

My motor was already broken in, so I didn't have to do it with the headers. Depending on how you build your motor, I've had motors built, broken in and dynoed out of the car, so it wouldn't be a problem this way either, or you could use a set of manifolds for first run. I'll have to take another look at the oil filter to give you a good idea, but I can't imagine it would be an issue. I was totally unconcerned with the one primary running outside the frame rail on each side, I don't know what the big deal is. Like I said, Olds V8 frame mounts, and 1970 455 motor mounts and it fits fine. The clutch fan is a good idea, I haven't run it in warm weather yet, but I think it will be ok. The radiator is a stock-ish G-body unit that I got from someone who ran it with a 403 and it ran cool. Very little to worry about with this swap as far as I can tell.
Mike - 1983 Oldsmobile 455 Cutlass
My build thread http://www.gbodyforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=35347&hilit=sleeper+build
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finman04
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby finman04 on Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:30 am

I really like the look of your headers and are going to go with them (made up my mind). My buddy has a 74 Nova with a 454 and had problems with his cooling, he has a alumium radiator with a pusher fan and has finally controlled it. He had me alittle concerned about cooling with the 455. Bet you cant wait to get your Cutty out since the weathers starting to break more.

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Intragration
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby Intragration on Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:54 pm

I don't know what kind of cam your buddy with the 454 was running, but I don't think a mild motor is going to have any problems, as long as you set up the cooling system properly. My theory is that people are putting cars together with parts from various cars, and they're forgetting to put the spring in the lower radiator hose, which is the low-pressure side of the system. Rev the motor a little bit and the hose collapses, keep the revs over 1,500 to 2,000 and it stays collapsed and flow is drastically reduced. Put a spring in, make sure the radiator isn't clogged, make sure the thermostat and cap are new, and use a working clutch fan with a shroud and you won't have any problems.

I've already had the car out a couple times, started right up. It's running good, but I really can't wait to get rid of the 2.41s. I have a family situation going on right now that's going to be taking most of my time, so not a lot is going to be happening in the near future. Will still be checking in though...
Mike - 1983 Oldsmobile 455 Cutlass
My build thread http://www.gbodyforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=35347&hilit=sleeper+build
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Blew86442
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby Blew86442 on Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:11 pm

Awesome build! I bought a cutlass with a sbc in it, it is a powerhouse but I have no idea what is done internally. Long story about that......

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Intragration
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby Intragration on Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:22 pm

A couple minor updates since the last time I posted. Money has been tight, so the axle is temporarily on hold. The old tires were getting pretty scary, so I found a set of used 215-65-15s and threw those on the cheap 15" wheels I bought last year. I liked the whitewalls for the sleeper effect, and if I was buying new tires I'd probably go with white letter since I love the way they look, but I think the blackwalls are pretty cool, better than I expected. Blackwalls usually look unfinished to me, but with the wheels all cleaned up, I think they look ok.

Big news is the timing. I was having a heck of a time getting it timed right. No matter what I tried, I couldn't get more than about 10 degrees of centrifugal advance. My CR is about 9.9:1, and with my chosen full-sized starter (I refuse to use a mini starter) warm starts become a little difficult with anything more than about 15 degrees of initial advance. As a result, I was running only about 25 degrees of total timing. I tried messing with the stock weights and centerplate, and also the Mr. Gasket recurve kit, but I couldn't get anything to work. Finally, I picked up a Moroso 72300 recurve kit, installed it with the lightest springs, and all my problems were solved. I now have initial set to 15 degrees, and I get about 20 degrees of centrifugal by around 3,000 RPM, for a total of 35 degrees. I went just a little beyond this, maybe 16/36 and I got a slight bit of detonation on a hot day, so I went back to 15/35. To this I added a Napa VC1853 vacuum advance unit, which starts advance at 5-7 in/hg. I limited it to 10 degrees of advance with a home made aluminum plate, and now it runs almost perfectly. It has better throttle response, more power, it doesn't lug anymore (even with the 2.41s) and it even stalls higher. Generally, it just feels stronger, but more relaxed and composed. I can't recommend it highly enough -- get your timing right!

6-2012a.jpg
Mike - 1983 Oldsmobile 455 Cutlass
My build thread http://www.gbodyforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=35347&hilit=sleeper+build
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84clonewars
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby 84clonewars on Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:22 pm

I dont believe your swap was that easy, stop by my house and drop your 455 in my Hurst just to prove it, yea thats it just to prove it lol. Any updates on the interior yet?
Antoine
84 Hurst Olds T-Tops - Puchased 11/13/11 - Olds 403 .020 over - #5 Heads - Comp XE262H Cam - Comp Roller Tip Rockers - Heddman Headers - Edelbrock Rpm Intake - 200-4R - 8.5" 3:73 Posi Rear -THE BRUISER
83 Buick Regal - Purchased 4/7/12 - 72 Buick 355 - TH350 - Digi Gauges - 7.5" Open 2:29 Rear - THE CRUISER
84 Chevy Camaro - Purchased 1/4/10 - T-Tops - Chevy 355 - 700R-4 - Posi 9 Bolt BW 3:42 Rear - 2000 Camaro Interior - Work In Progress - THE ABUSER

84 Buick Regal Limited - 75 Olds 350 - 350 BOP Trans - KILLED BY FAMILY MEMBER 8/10/11

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Intragration
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Re: Cutlass Supreme budget sleeper build

Postby Intragration on Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:50 pm

84clonewars wrote:I dont believe your swap was that easy, stop by my house and drop your 455 in my Hurst just to prove it, yea thats it just to prove it lol. Any updates on the interior yet?


Ha ha wait, do I get my engine back after that? :) No additional mods yet, I've got a small crisis situation that I'm trying to get past, and then car life can get back to normal.
Mike - 1983 Oldsmobile 455 Cutlass
My build thread http://www.gbodyforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=35347&hilit=sleeper+build
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