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DBW vs DBC

Discussion in 'G-Body LS Swap' started by Dinosport, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. Dinosport

    Dinosport G-Body Guru

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    I have an ly6 Im getting ready to swap into my Malibu. Im planning on using the E38 ecm, I have both a DBW and DBC throttle body. So Im curious can the E38 ECM be programed to work with a DBC throttle body? I ask because Im using a 700r4 and it will be challenging to figure out how to get the pressure cable to be pulled under throttle with a DBW throttle body. I can also save on the cost and time of installing an electronic pedal in the car? Anybody that has come across this please chime in. I want to install the engine this winter and right now next on my list is engine control.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  2. 81cutlass

    81cutlass G-Body Guru

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    A Gen IV E38 ecm is only DBW. p01 99-02 is DBC with rare 01-02 denali/escalade DBW. 03-07 P59 is all DBW minus rare DBC in vans and 04 GTO's.

    You can basically
    -Keep the e38 and go 4l60e
    -Get a linginfelter 58x to 24x box and get a p01/p59 harness/ecu


    Personally TV cables are just a pain. Sell the 700r4 for $300 and buy a $500 4l60e, or $300 80e. Get a stronger trans, with full control via the ecm. Your going to end up spending decent money on a LS TV cable adaptor anyways. A 700R also needs the 6.0 flat flex plate and crank .4" spacer unless you run a special nose converter.
     
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  3. Dinosport

    Dinosport G-Body Guru

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    Oh well I figured Id ask. The trans is new and buying another one would set me back past the time I want to have it done. A friend of mine gave me an idea that in theory should work done right and thats to bring the cable in the car and attach it to the pedal itself or make a lever off the pedal that would pivot and pull the cable. I guess for now Ill go that route. Ill try and get a harness that has the connector for 4l60 so i could do that in the future if I feel the need.
    Thanks
     
  4. CWPottenger

    CWPottenger G-Body Guru

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    Personally I do not like DBW and if I needed to would modify the TB so ECU thinks it has DBW but is cable controlled
     
  5. Dinosport

    Dinosport G-Body Guru

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    How would you do that?
     
  6. CWPottenger

    CWPottenger G-Body Guru

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    You would have to change out the reluctor wheel to a 24tooth reluctor and a different cam gear. Then you just need a 24t ECU and harness. The 24tooth systems can be programmed for DBC or DBW. The 58T systems are DBW only.

    also when converting you will lose the integrated cruise control of the DBW systems and would have to add a stand alone cruise control.
     
  7. Dinosport

    Dinosport G-Body Guru

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    Thats too much work for me to do that. I have enough on my plate with this swap now.
     
  8. Dinosport

    Dinosport G-Body Guru

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    So guys Im thinking I dont want a 4l60 right now. What I really want is a t56. Just cant afford it at this time. I have an idea and it wont cost me anything to try. I have 2 throttle bodies one is the truck one and the other is what would come on an ls3 stock. I walking into my chevy dealer and they gave me a junk electric truck throttle body. Im going to take it apart and see if I can drill a hole on the opposite side of the connector, and somehow attach a cam from a cable throttle body. The guys at the chevy dealer said the motor would be fine doing that, they never have a problem with the motor its usually the electrical connector that goes bad inside. I have nothing to lose and it may be fun actually to see if I can make that work. Once Ive driven the car for bit with 6.0 in it, it will give me time to save and decide if I want to do 60-80 or just save for the t56.
     
  9. 81cutlass

    81cutlass G-Body Guru

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    My comments-

    You can do a cheaper t56, I did it. An LT1 t56 with mcloed flywheel, ls1 clutch, t5 hydro TOB and .4" crank spacer can be done for ~$1000. Cut the bottom of the bellhousing out to clear the larger flywheel. It took some figuring but I got it worked out good!

    Word of warning, from my experience the amp draw "drag" the DBW TB's is closely monitored I think. I tried running a dual port ford DBW TB on my 01-02 DBW denali setup (same as a C5 vette). Worked with the ignition on, engine off and it worked. Engine fired up and the TB wouldn't work.

    Had to go with a silver blade LS2 DBW TB.

    You can convert your harness to a DBC setup. Get a van ECM or one that has the Idle air control IAC valve control on it. Get wires and repin the harness from DBW to DBC, string new wires to the TB to run the IAC and redo the TPS.
     
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  10. Anubis

    Anubis Royal Smart Person

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    I ran across this decision when I was deciding what pullout to buy. You can search LS1tech to find more information but I don't think GM ever used a cable with the E38 so finding a tuner that can accomplish this feat will be difficult if not impossible.

    The 700R4 is a great transmission but I think even a stock LY6 will tear it up. I would go 4L80E. You can buy them in LKQ yards for a few bills providing you are willing to pull it out yourself and have someone go though it. A stock 4L80E is good for 500-600hp.

    I was skeptical about DBW after reading some ignorant claims on line about how it is sluggish and problematic. Nothing could be further from the truth. I have excellent throttle response with no issues or complaints. Mounting the pedal takes some thought but not a big deal. One of the members on LS1tech cobbled his transmission TV cable to the DBW pedal. Looked like a mess to me but it has been done. Search the G body swap thread in the conversions section.
     
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