BUILD THREAD Project Olds Cool (Recognition!!)

[Rktpwrd]

Thank you everyone for the replies and suggestions.
I assure you I will be taking each and every one into consideration as I get closer to making it happen. There's been some excellent ideas proposed here, and they're very close along the lines of what I've already been considering.

Ughhh...that looks eerily familiar to my roof rot malibu. But not nearly as bad. Good that you found the piece you needed and in great shape. Especially locally. I think you already have a good plan of attack. Removing the spot welds along the channel. Then of course the brass that's melted to the area where skin meets A pillar. On mine, the first replacement skin I had which was easier to work with not on car, I ground along the top of drip rail channel to remove those tiny spot welds and used a cutoff wheel in between the welds to seperate and peel away. In hindsight I wish I would have used my dremel to seperate instead of grinder. It took away a little more than I wanted in a couple places. Those spot welds in the drip rail area are tiny and numerous.

The new replacement whole skin I have I will do the same, a little more carefully, from the underside as if I was sitting in car with it still attached to car. So as not to damage the outer skin. The old skin still on car, well 3/4 of it, will be done from the top to leave the bottom structure intact.

I believe you already have a great plan in your head mr Donovan. You do great work. With great attention to detail. You already did one section across roof that came out great, maybe try that same or similar approach with this section. That was just my .02 cents and ramblings. I am very interested to see what you finally decide to do.

Thank you David.
Actually as soon as I saw this additional rust in the windshield channel, I thought of you and your son's car. They seem to have suffered similar issues, with mine not being quite as extensive.

I'm glad to hear you've got a plan and have been making some headway on yours as well. I wish you both the best of luck, be sure to keep us all posted on your progress!

Thank you for the suggestion and support.

Donovan, I trust your judgement more than my own but if it were me I would cut out onto the car's roof skin the bare minimum and flange the repair piece to slip under it to help minimize distortion. I wonder if you can get the clecos in that area with the roof brace right under it?

That's definitely along the lines of what I've been thinking and considering Jared. That's an excellent suggestion to flange and plug weld or panel bond the pieces. My only stumbling block at this point is exactly where to do it to ensure the distortion is going to be kept to a minimum.
I do believe there is enough room for Clecos in that area, but I'm going to do some more cleanup and grind the moulding clip mounting studs off first to see if I can keep the repair area confined to the channel area. If that's not feasible, I'll look at flanging the replacement and going further back.

Thanks very much for the suggestion, this is quite possibly the direction I'll be going.

glad to see that the windshield setback didn't dampen your determination for long! as always, I'll be looking forward to the way you approach this and how you incorporate the piece.

know that you're helping at least one person learn from this, as it gave me the courage to try this on the chief. At work, when we get a new person on the line, alot of the guys will tell the new guy that the work has to be done a certain way, but I let them know "this is how I do it, you'll find your own way of doing it in time... This is how I feel that you're doing with documenting these repairs-as a guide for us to see, and get it accomplished in our own comfort levels.

it helped me get from this:

to this:


I won't horrify you with pics of my bad welds, but that is now sealed up, and I will move to other spots to do the same...

thanks, and keep the updates and great work coming!
Darin

Darin, that's awesome sir!
I'm truly humbled that I've inspired you and a few others to tackle these ugly repairs. It's looking like you're off to a great start, I'd love to continue to see your progress as you go.

Thanks very much for the encouragement and faith in my abilities, I really appreciate it.

It is nice to see you can admit to failure and share it for the benefit of others, rather than hide it and pretend you are without fault.

Impressive work as always.

I am a bit perplexed why you didn't grab all the 442 parts and flip them (money and space limitations notwithstanding) - I highly doubt there will be repros.

Thanks Mike.
If you knew me in person, you'd know that I'm not the type of guy to put myself up as something or someone that I'm not. I'm human, I make mistakes and f**k up just like anyone else. To pose as someone that doesn't would be lying first and foremost to myself, never mind to others.

I think it's probably more beneficial for everyone else to see my mistakes, and how they happened. There's no shame in screwing up or admitting to it, in my eyes it's all in how you correct it.

As for as capitalizing on the exclusivity of the 442, as I mentioned earlier, all the 442 specific stuff that made it desirable was already long gone before I got to it.
The 442 badges inside and out, the rallye pac gauges, the 3 spoke steering wheel, and the aluminum 442 wheels, all gone already.
By the time I got to it, it was really only just a black and gold Cutlass with bucket seats and an Olds 350.

Sorry to see the set back with the front window channel Donovan...again looks like you've got the solution in hand....great that the 442 channel is a nice one. Carry on my friend!

Thanks very much Kevin.
I'm not sure I have the current situation fully in hand just yet, but I'm sure working on it.
It was certainly a blessing that the 442 piece was in good shape, I'd shudder to think what I'd do without it...

Can you cut the roof at the edge of the window channel and slip this piece in underneath, bond it away from the joint, then weld it in at the edge?

This is what I'd love to do Quinn, thanks for the suggestion.

Only, there's a couple hitches to that plan:
1) The existing channel is rusty, even on the vertical section. Slipping the new piece in behind kinda defeats the purpose of having good clean metal to work with.
2) We have to consider the moulding mounting studs. Whether I use the old ones or the ones on the new piece, they have to be taken into consideration. I can't see how I'd be able to keep them and overlap the edges that close together. That is, unless the top 1/2" or so of the existing channel is in useable shape. (Which I don't fully know yet, I'm going to have to do some more cleanup there first).

That is, unless I'm missing something that you're thinking of and I'm not...???

But I think I would plug weld the pinch weld however you could just bond it all except the ends those I would but up and weld dose that 442 have a good left quarter bottom and trunk floor extension?

Eric, I'll definitely be plug welding the overlapping flanges back together. There will be holes in the new piece from drilling out the old spot welds anyways, so I may as well reuse them as the holes to weld to the underlying flange.
The edges where it meets the "A" pillars will most definitely be welded, no question there.

TBH, I'm not really sure what the condition of that area on the 442 is, I never looked. If you're serious about having me look at it for you, let me know, but it won't be for another couple weeks. I work during regular business hours Monday to Friday, and I have previous commitments next weekend.

Again, thanks to everyone for the ideas and suggestions. It really is appreciated. I still haven't come to a final decision on how I'm going to do this, I want to work on the existing channel a bit more yet to see if it'll help make the decision for me.

Donovan.

 

[Rktpwrd]

I did get several free hours to work out in the garage today, so I spent my time concentrating on preparing the new piece for installation.

Surprisingly, it took the better part of the day. The areas where the outer skin meets the "A" pillars is pretty complex, there's a lot of different parts that all overlap and attach there.
I started by trimming down the sections of "A" pillars just below these attaching points. From there I shortened up the outer skin a couple inches up from the body line and made it uniform.

With that done, I fired up the propane torch and melted out the lead from the roof to "A" pillar seams. If you're doing something similar to this at home, this is the proper way to remove the lead from these areas.
DO NOT sand or grind the lead, as we all know it's toxic and you don't want it airborne.
The lead they used has a low melting point, a little heat from a propane torch is all that's needed to melt it out.

With the lead removed, I was able to get a bit clearer idea of how the different panels were attached. I had to grind and cut through the brass brazed areas at each end inside the channel, and then a couple of careful cuts were placed to separate the channel and skin section from the rest of the structure. This is easier described than accomplished!

This left just the spot welds along the flange to drill out and separate. Drilling out spot welds I find a very frustrating endeavour. It seems no matter how carefully I look, feel, and estimate where the exact center of the weld is, I usually seem to miss at least a little bit of it.

After redrilling a few that I missed edges on, and one or two completely hidden ones, I finally got the section I wanted out. After spending more time cleaning up edges, hammer and dollying the flange flat again, and numerous other areas that needed attention, I had the replacement section cleaned up and ready to go.

There's not really much worthy of pics here, but here's a couple anyways:

It's still purposely cut oversize until I figure out the final plan of attack, but it's always easier to trim more off than add it back on.

Tonight after work I will concentrate on cleaning up the existing channel on the car a bit more and see if I can at least utilize the top 1/2" or even 1/4" below the roof edge or so. If I can, I think I will be able to keep the repair confined to the channel area, which I think would yield the best outcome.

I'll report back here tomorrow night with my findings, and we'll see if I'm any closer to a resolution.

Thanks for coming along on this crazy, rusty journey with me everyone!

D.

 

[motorheadmike]

Totally missed the part where the car had already been picked over.

 

[Texas82GP]

Donovan, if the trim 'rivets' are a concern, keep in mind you can easily weld on new ones with your stud gun. We had to when we put new quarters on my brother's car.

 

[ssn696]

This is what I'd love to do Quinn, thanks for the suggestion.

Only, there's a couple hitches to that plan:
1) The existing channel is rusty, even on the vertical section. Slipping the new piece in behind kinda defeats the purpose of having good clean metal to work with.
2) We have to consider the moulding mounting studs. Whether I use the old ones or the ones on the new piece, they have to be taken into consideration. I can't see how I'd be able to keep them and overlap the edges that close together. That is, unless the top 1/2" or so of the existing channel is in useable shape. (Which I don't fully know yet, I'm going to have to do some more cleanup there first).

That is, unless I'm missing something that you're thinking of and I'm not...???

Can you cut the original roof back to the point shown in red and slip this up under? Cut it in half in the middle to make insertion easier?

By the way, I dig your Surgery...the die grinder on the left is identical to my old favorite that recently gave out after 20 years of hard use.

 

[TURNA]

Well for some reason I didn't get the notifications on this thread so I just read through all of them.

AMAZING work!!!

I could not even think of attempting the body work you are doing to this Olds.

All I can say is AMAZING!!

 

[sportriderOK]

I'm going to kiss my Monte's roof skin when I get home....

I know you'll knock this out in your usual style. Whatever method you use, it'll turn out great.

 

[axisg]

I am real interested in how the Omni Single stage works out for you. I need to touch up the bumpers on my monte which is 90's Acrylic over the orig Laquer. I have used their base / clear before on my work van and it went down smooth and holding up well. Well for a 100 % novice who painted it in November outside of course

 

[Blake442]

I would flange the roof skin if there's room for the tool, drop the patch on top, glue along the visible edge, weld the corners, plug weld the window channel and done.
Keep up the good work!

 

[Rktpwrd]

Donovan, if the trim 'rivets' are a concern, keep in mind you can easily weld on new ones with your stud gun. We had to when we put new quarters on my brother's car.

Thanks for the reminder on that great tip Jared. I had heard of doing that before, but forgot all about it until you mentioned it again.

I don't think I'll need to do that on the front channel as I'm pretty sure I will be able to use the ones in the new piece, but I sure could put that to good use on the back one.

Because it was a vinyl top car, there are no studs to mount the clips. I was going to just use small self drilling screws to attach the clips like I did years ago on The Juggernaut, but this is a better idea.

Because I've never done it before, could you please elaborate on how you and Sean did it on his car?
Did you use the standard studs that are used with the slide hammer, or are there specific studs you can buy to weld in place?

Thanks for any info you can share on this!

Can you cut the original roof back to the point shown in red and slip this up under? Cut it in half in the middle to make insertion easier?


By the way, I dig your Surgery...the die grinder on the left is identical to my old favorite that recently gave out after 20 years of hard use.
View attachment 70145

Thanks for the clarification and suggestion Quinn. I really appreciate it.
I can certainly do that, in fact I think that's going to be "Plan B". I'm going to shoot for "Plan A" first (see tonight's update), but if Plan A doesn't pan out, that'll be my backup alternative. The idea of cutting the new piece in half to make it easier to work with is great, I may end up having to do that.
Thank you!

Well for some reason I didn't get the notifications on this thread so I just read through all of them.

AMAZING work!!!

I could not even think of attempting the body work you are doing to this Olds.

All I can say is AMAZING!!

Thanks Turna! Appreciate it man.


Sorry to hear you've been missing out on the updates, but now that you're here, welcome!
There'll be lots more to come, I look forward to hearing from you more.

I'm going to kiss my Monte's roof skin when I get home....

I know you'll knock this out in your usual style. Whatever method you use, it'll turn out great.

Thanks for the confidence... I need all I can get lately!
Lol

I am real interested in how the Omni Single stage works out for you. I need to touch up the bumpers on my monte which is 90's Acrylic over the orig Laquer. I have used their base / clear before on my work van and it went down smooth and holding up well. Well for a 100 % novice who painted it in November outside of course

Stay tuned then, as I shouldn't really be too far off from getting ready to shoot color in the window channels. I've used Omni products before, they're good quality and easy to use with satisfactory results.

Thanks for commenting!

I would flange the roof skin if there's room for the tool, drop the patch on top, glue along the visible edge, weld the corners, plug weld the window channel and done.
Keep up the good work!

Oh Blake.
Oh dear, dear sweet Blake.
You make it all sound so simple and easy sir!

If only it were so... But you and I both know it's a pile of work anyway you look at it.

Your suggestion is excellent, the only issue I have with it is being able to flange the roof skin, especially in the corners. That's where it would get a little more complicated.
No worries tho, I believe I've come up with a plan that'll work...
See tonight's update for the details.

The wagon is looking great BTW, glad you're finally getting her out on the road. Enjoy your first trip and show with it!

D.