CUTLASS OEM 85 vs. 87 V8 A/C Hose Assemblies Not The Same

Although the replacement parts fit both, I never really noticed the differences that the V8 hose assemblies have between the 85 and 88 Cutlass. In 1985, the OEM hoses are SLIGHTLY different than 86-88. Although they mate up and fit the same, the metal line coming out of the muffler bottom to the condenser is slightly smaller in diameter on the 86-88. Additionally, the 85 compressor suction hose is a hair shorter, but the metal tube is slightly longer. It still is the same overall length, but there's more hose on the later hose. Parker was the manufacturer of the hose assemblies, so obviously they used Parker rubber barrier hoses. 80-84 used a slightly different assembly, GM p/n 22505485. The OEM GM part number for 1985 was 22525317. It was a one-year deal for whatever reason. 86-88 was p/n 25526129. The Parker hoses, however, are strange. They used Parker Parflex 80 hoses, which were, at that time, typical hydraulic hoses. I mean, wtf? Both hoses have the black phenolic nut to attach the suction hose to the accumulator. This is how you tell and OEM hose from a replacements. All the OEM 85-88 Parker assemblies have the black phenolic nut and all replacement hoses have metal attachment nuts at the acuumulator. Plus, the replacement hose assemblies, even GM over the counter ones, are R134a compliant.

Four Seasons 55479 is the aftermarket replacement for the 85-88 hose assembly.

Four Seasons 55071 is the aftermarket replacement for the 80-84 hose assembly.

Here's a chart lifted from a place in Ft. Lauderdale that does A/C work and has stuff and supplies. Gives AC Delco and GM part numbers for Cutlass hoses. The PBI part number is the vendor's part number, so never mind that.

Everyone likes pics. 1985 hose on top, 1987 hose on bottom. You can see the difference here that the 1985 hose assembly compressor suction hose end that connects to the accumulator has the black plastic nut and a longer metal tube section. Thus, the 1987 hose has 3.25" longer hose piece to make up for the shorter metal fitting piece.



The 1987 OEM hose has the GM part number stamped right on the crimp sleeve. The 1985 version has no part numbers stamped on it.


The 1985 condenser side hose. I removed the foam rubber insulator sleeve and you can see the stampings. Parflex 80, 10mm.



The 1987 condenser side hose. Parflex 80 with 7652 designator stamped on it.

Oh, and this to add- finding the proper size closed cell foam tubing is kinda being problematic. It seems like it's not off-the-shelf kind of stuff. Depending on how it's measured, it's either got 1/4" thick wall tubing or close to 3/8". It's hard to measure the stuff with calipers because of its sponginess. Although I can't prove anything with old, original foam tubes, it stands to reason that they weren't really used for insulation. They used a dab of glue on the insulation for the hoses to keep them from sliding around. Which tells me it was not designed to be primarily used for insulation because otherwise it would be tighter against the hoses. Plus, why wouldn't the metal sections be insulated, too? Rather, the main reason, IMO, is simply for hose abrasion protection. There's no refrigerant temperature consideration that I can see because the one side is the "hot liquid" side going to the condenser, and it's got a 6" piece of foam insulation on it. Can't be for people's burn protection because the fittings and everything else on that side, save for those 6" of foam, is uninsulated, so "burn" considerations are still in effect. Plus, some of the newer cars don't even have insulators on the A/C hoses. And the suction side- it can't be for condensation protection since you should only be pulling vapor at that point, so the refrigerant shouldn't be cooling anything AFTER the accumulator. If everything was running right, you may get some condensation on the accumulator inlet side, but that should be about it.

Add to that, the rubber hoses are somewhat self-insulating anyway. It's possible there's some secondary benefit of the hose being insulated somewhat as engine heat will be abated from the hose providing some temperature degradation over time. But I'm simply speculating.

If anyone has a real answer to the foam tubes, I'm all ears.

And now, lemme tell you something you may not know...you might, but then again, it's something not many people ever bother to do.

The factory has 3 ports in the A/C system for 85-88 Cutlass with Schrader valves in them. Two on the accumulator (low side) and one on the muffler (high side).

The beauty of one of the ports on the back side of the accumulator is that its used for the pressure control switch to kick the compressor on/off based on low side pressure. The other port is for normal charging of the R-12 refrigerant. The high side port on the muffler is not normally used for service, but only for pressure gage monitoring during operation.

The good thing is that all the Schrader valves in the system are the same. They're nothing special really, just like a tire valve stem valve innards. However, they're made specifically for the A/C systems.

G-bodies use ACDelco 15-1119 (GM# 3041827) as the Schrader cores. The Schrader p/n is 8080580047. GM is REALLY proud of these little valves, typically list price is around 14 and change!! Highway robbery. They're just re-packaged Schrader valves.

Now, the hard part. These jokers LOVE to corrode in place. Aluminum pieces with rubber seals and such, makes it tough as the cores love to "weld" themselves into place. Especially the high side ones on the mufflers.

So when I went to remove the valves on the 1987 OEM hose set, I was met with almost instant resistance. Yeah, there's a plastic cap with an o-ring seal on them keeping junk out, but for whatever reason, they were STUBBORN to remove, even with a good tire core tool. I sprayed some brake cleaner in the core hole, then used the wife's toothbrush...ok, an OLD toothbrush, to scrub out most of the gunk. Then I put a couple drops of mineral oil in there and started working the valve core back and forth. I worked it loose and started to remove it and noticed the valve stem wasn't moving, so the head came up to meet the top of the center stem. WTF?

Turns out, the core was F'd up at this point. I couldn't see it, but what happened was the core was stuck at the seal, and the base wasn't coming out. The threaded core did. So it simply separated the threaded head from the base. Broken valve. So I used a pair of needle nose pliers and pulled up on it, hoping the valve at the bottom wouldn't come off and drop into the muffler. Pop. Out came the head, spring and center pin. Fugg. The valve poppet at the bottom of the center pin popped off and fell into the muffler.

Now the fun part. These jokers are SUPER small, like 0.21" in diameter. So not much is going to get to it. I don't have any easy-outs that small. Klein tools makes a special easy out for this very thing, on a double tip valve core removal/install tool on one end, flip it around for the easy out. Comes with the 11 in 1 tool. For $20. I went to the garage and found a flat top philips head screw that would fit into the hole. Gave it about a half turn to get some "bite" into the husk sitting in the hole, and then used the needle nose pliers to pull the screw and husk out of the hole. SUCCESS! It was in there tight!

Don't know what's in the muffler but it's apparently got some baffle system in it because the loose poppet wouldn't make its way through the muffler to the discharge line. Now, I wouldn't normally give a crap, but I'm taking these to an A/C repair shop to get the rubber hoses replaced, so I don't need any foreign object floating around in the system should I use the hose. For around $80 I can have 2 restored OEM A/C assemblies. Just one of those aftermarket deals is close to $100. Anyway, had to get that poppet out. Shaking it around was sorta funny to watch I guess, but about 3 minutes later I got it to come out the compressor discharge hole in the fitting.

The 1985 high side valve core was no picnic either. It did the SAME thing. This time, I was ready. But this time the head came off the center pin when the threaded head came out and now the valve was just missing a head. So I pulled and pulled and couldn't get a great bite on the center pin to try and get it loose from the poppet. The spring got messed up and wasn't very springy, so I took a small drill bit blunt in and pressed it down hoping to pop it off inside maybe. It went down and stuck. Nothing popped off. Good. I took the screw from before, turned it in a 1/2 turn roughly, and pulled out the entire valve assembly. Didn't have to fish for any broken parts.

So now, it's waiting for my new Schrader valves to arrive, along with the special 13/64" - 36 tap. The threads aren't goobered up too bad, as I had an old accumulator I stole a "good" valve core out of and it went right into both mufflers without jamming. Going to run the tap through the threads anyway, just to make sure. Then flush them out and get them ready for the new hoses.

Again, nobody thinks about these things, but these little valves can make you crazy when they don't want to come out easy.

Hose assemblies still are available aftermarket. 4 seasons 55479. About 77 bucks at Rockauto.

Orifice tube- GM p/n 3033839. There are variable ones out there and all that other junk, but the GM one works in most instances.

Not sure about the Evap.- GM p/n 3058311 or aftermarket equivalent. Keep in mind the aftermarket units SOMETIMES have their hookup piping not quite in the correct locations and some tweaking may be involved. I remember reading something about that somewhere.

Accumulators- DON'T bother with an NOS original unless you're going with R-12 (GM p/n 3059315). Reason is this- the dessicant won't be compatible with anything other than R-12. If you get a newer, aftermarket replacement, they usually tell you which dessicant is in them, and most are compatible with the newer refrigerants. 4 Seasons 33185 has dessicant compatible with R-12 and 134a. Plus compatible refrigerants.

As far as the dessicant, type XH-5 for R12 and XH7 & XH9 for R12 & R134a. MOST aftermarkets use XH9, but you gotta check that it's not XH-5.

Condensers- eh...maybe. Spectra 74013 is the replacement. It's a cross flow, like most all new ones.

Liquid line from condenser to orifice tube- UNOBTAINIUM. If you're lucky enough to find an NOS one, it's part number 10036850. Probably need to get one from a junkyard jewel if you don't have one. 85-88. Monte, Cutlass, GP. It's an all metal line, so I really don't understand why SOMEONE hasn't repro'ed that thing yet. It's a tad tricky, sure, but c'mon, there's not much to the thing. Just need to bend it correctly and put a plastic protector on a small section.

rfpowerdude said:

I failed to mention that I have all of the original stuff. It's just so old and has been open to the atmosphere (albeit, my garage atmosphere) for a loonnnng time. Not sure what all I should replace or reuse.

That will eventually be for another thread...

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If your accumulator has been open to atmosphere for 3 hours or more, replace it. Dessicant will suck up moisture, and unless it's that new expensive lubricant, it won't let the moisture go that easy.

All the metal junk, if kept internally capped off, should be ok to re-use as long as it's not corroded, such as Evap, condenser, condenser metal return line, compressor (although I'd put new sealing rings and shaft seal in it prior to reusing). You likely can flush the pee out of it to clean it out, though. Although they fare better if you cap off open ends. 37 year old hoses would likely do good to get those replaced, however. And just put a new orifice in because they're relatively cheap and you can't really clean those properly. And of course, all new o-ring seals.

This is just what I would do. But you do you.

69hurstolds said:

G-bodies use ACDelco 15-1119 (GM# 3041827) as the Schrader cores. The Schrader p/n is 8080580047. GM is REALLY proud of these little valves, typically list price is around 14 and change!! Highway robbery. They're just re-packaged Schrader valves.

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Just want to add, I found out some more info on these cores. If you're using R12 and such with mineral oil, then the 15-1119 core works, as it has a neoprene seal on it. However, if using in a 134a system or converting to something else, it is recommended to use the Schrader p/n 8081070047 valve core. It's the same valve specs as the original core, just has a green hydrogenated nitrile rubber (HNBR) seal on it. HNBR is better for the systems with the newer refrigerants over the neoprene. It's what those green O-rings in the 134a systems are made out of. The ACDelco number for the "newer refrigerant" green seal core is 15-63665 (GM# 25872392) but it will work in a R12 system retrofit. Is it worth the extra hassle? I dunno. So I'm going to get a couple of those too, just for the heck of it.

Wow. Info keeps rolling in. Now I knew early 1986 Cutlass/442 with 307 had 198 compressors vs. the later 622s, but now because of doing some research on the hoses, it appears the early 86 Cutlass also used the 85 style hose, at least early on. When the change happened, I don't know. Probably when they went to the 622 compressors. Also, although it doesn't show it in this picture, the A.I.R. pump is coded FP on this 86 (with like 3700 miles). The "F" signifies first use on 1985 year models. So it appears there are carryover parts from 85 to 86. And here I was thinking it was a one year only deal. Maybe year and a half.

Another supposition I have with the 307 Y engines was the heater hose that wrapped around the A/C unit. It's the return line from the heater core. What I'm supposing is that when the defroster needs to be used, the compressor kicks in and refrigerant is sent through the system to allow the evaporator to draw moisture from the cabin air to ensure you're not blowing more wetness on an ice-cold windshield in the winter. Then, as the heater core warms up, it adds heat to the accumulator to ensure any residual liquid refrigerant is converted to a gas for the compressor to prevent any slugging. Now, the VIN 9 cars didn't have this "loop" around the accumulator. So it's like, hmm. They did have a clamp on the intake to press the heater hose up against the carb choke housing. I guess to keep it hot? For what friggin' reason? Hot air from the crossover heating the air going to the choke should keep it warm. Not sure why. It seems the EFE valve would be closed during warm up forcing hot air across the choke tube in the intake...anyone got any engineering reasons as to wtf that's all about? Simply speculating. I haven't read any of this anywhere.