I cant say I've been a member of the Gbody family for very long, (1984 Olds cutty v6 231 i got from my uncle 2 years ago)) but I do consider myself a dedicated convert and proud to be among this great G body community. Huge kudos to the passionate and knowledgeable members of gbodyforum.com for all the great advice and support guys like me rely on to keep rolling.
first let me get the unpleasantries out of the way so as to take my medicine (or in my case ridicule) like a man.
+ yes i have a v6 and yes i love it. (i decided to keep her 100% stock just like my uncle had her, so no V8)
+ I'm in California. (its inhumane to choke out a perfectly good V8 with all these smog requirements)
+ Yes im doing the transmission rebuild myself (My kid just left for college. last of my money went with him)
ive' hung around the website picking up quality tips and advice long enough to know that I had better do my research and do all I can to solve my issues BEFORE i post a new thread, so as to not waste the forum's time. And only THEN, should a new thread be started. and Yes, I did my homework. But I'm even more confused on several key issues regarding my 84 cutty 231 V6. and my transmission. Ill try to keep it short as possible.
1) transmission RECOGNITION: the advice given on how to tell what transmission you got in your ride is tantamount to reading tea leaves or tarot cards or using the force. Most rides here are V8 (i get why) and most info is regarding trannys for V8s and heavily favors all the other models (chevy buick pontiac) that sifting through all the threads is truly a needle in the haystack when it comes to the V6 and the 200c. and yes i have a repair manual.
2) WAY TOO MANY nicknames. Ive seen TH, Turbo, 200, 200r4, 700r4, th200, hydra, and to boot thats just for GM.
Chevy (309, 350), dodge pontiac etc, have their own equivalent models of transmission with different names and subtle variances. AND NONE of these ive just named are even mine. i have a 200c "metric" (yes i NOW finally get the differences between trannys based on model name, (3 speed v 4 speed OD etc.) but again I cant find anything on specific repairs or even diagrams for the 200c for definitive identification of specific trannys in what cars. Hell, not even on the ID plate ON my transmission says 200c on it and the best Identification advice i found was one identifier on some trannys is the transmission has a cut corner???? way too many confusing "tips and tricks" i had to sift thru to learn that I didnt have ANY of those, ( It took me 3days to realize 200c and 200r4 have suble and major differences besides just OD. adapter plates and gear ratios. case in point ....
===== help: haha i believe the chevy 350 fits better in my Olds Cutlass than the GM 200r4 in terms of straight swap,no adapter needed. True? not true? because my notes say thats true. haha go figure.
if someone could please tell me if im right about my transmission so i dont use a different repair manual and wonder why i have extra screws at the end, id appreciate it.
3) CONSENSUS FROM THE FORUM re MY DIAGNOSTICS AND SOLUTION: DETAILS of INCIDENT: I was on the freeway having just left for work when white smoke began to fill the cab with white smoke. My first thought was electrical fire. immediately pull over, investigate (IE rip my dash off) no fire. Open the hood and look down below, i find the culprit... ATF fluid basically FLOWING out (sudden massive fluid loss, like a catastrophic part failure, not failure drawn out over time.) right where the engine and transmission meet and pouring on to the Catalytic converter (the white smoke). Here is where it gets foggy for me. After putting in a spare quart of ATF i had in the trunk and limpimg home, i parked her and she sat for 3 days. I turned her on at that time and NO GEARS WHATSOEVER engaged. BUT... then i rechecked the Transmission dipstick and it showed i almost had TOO MUCH ATF but I know the puddle i left on the side of the road was considerable. Even so much that there HAD to be some indication of less ATF even if just for the size of the puddle. And before you ask, i have NOT added ATF recently (id probably say over a year) where OVERFILLING might be considered the cause of "too much" pressure, thereby rupturing a seal leading to the sudden fluid loss and no gears.
With that said, and after doing my research and reviewing available info on forums, sites,etc. ive concluded its the front pump seal that needs to be replaced.
But HOW to do this is where opinions really start to vary. Some say just change the seal. some transmission places say all seals need to be done along w torque converter and pump, or the seal will just blow again. Some others (dealerships mainly) say i need an ENTIRE rebuild (both front and back).
so i ask the ever wise Gbodyforum... what do you guys think is the best solution and what specific methods or protocols MUST be adhered to for successful rebuild? (I.E. methodology, tips or tricks not written in repair manual etc but vital to success)
is my conclusion correct about the front pump seal?
IF so, do i...?
+ just replace the seal,
+replace all seals, torque converter and front pump at the same time.
+do total rebuild?
Ive had the car long enough that i Feel comfortable with the emissions, Carb, CCC, etc. (learning how to chip her and tune her is next) and I rebuilt the carb myself first try with good success so I will definitely pay attention to detail being that its my first ever attempt at rebuilding a transmission.
BUT... My ride is an 84 and i need to be realistic. if i cant get her to pass smog this year, coupled with the cost of rebuild transmission, (even with me DIY) puts me in a bad spot financially so i get one shot at this. Any advice, nuggets of info, or knowledge RE: 200c Metric transmission rebuild would be GREATLY appreciated.
Sorry for the length of this post. Trust me I really debated posting this because I have been so overwhelmed the last 2 weeks, but truth is my family and i need this car. So its with great humility that i thank any and all here at gbodyforum in advance for for your considerations. thanks again and god bless.
"...Fortune favors the Brave."
-Latin Proverb
Arsan4000
first let me get the unpleasantries out of the way so as to take my medicine (or in my case ridicule) like a man.
+ yes i have a v6 and yes i love it. (i decided to keep her 100% stock just like my uncle had her, so no V8)
+ I'm in California. (its inhumane to choke out a perfectly good V8 with all these smog requirements)
+ Yes im doing the transmission rebuild myself (My kid just left for college. last of my money went with him)
ive' hung around the website picking up quality tips and advice long enough to know that I had better do my research and do all I can to solve my issues BEFORE i post a new thread, so as to not waste the forum's time. And only THEN, should a new thread be started. and Yes, I did my homework. But I'm even more confused on several key issues regarding my 84 cutty 231 V6. and my transmission. Ill try to keep it short as possible.
1) transmission RECOGNITION: the advice given on how to tell what transmission you got in your ride is tantamount to reading tea leaves or tarot cards or using the force. Most rides here are V8 (i get why) and most info is regarding trannys for V8s and heavily favors all the other models (chevy buick pontiac) that sifting through all the threads is truly a needle in the haystack when it comes to the V6 and the 200c. and yes i have a repair manual.
2) WAY TOO MANY nicknames. Ive seen TH, Turbo, 200, 200r4, 700r4, th200, hydra, and to boot thats just for GM.
Chevy (309, 350), dodge pontiac etc, have their own equivalent models of transmission with different names and subtle variances. AND NONE of these ive just named are even mine. i have a 200c "metric" (yes i NOW finally get the differences between trannys based on model name, (3 speed v 4 speed OD etc.) but again I cant find anything on specific repairs or even diagrams for the 200c for definitive identification of specific trannys in what cars. Hell, not even on the ID plate ON my transmission says 200c on it and the best Identification advice i found was one identifier on some trannys is the transmission has a cut corner???? way too many confusing "tips and tricks" i had to sift thru to learn that I didnt have ANY of those, ( It took me 3days to realize 200c and 200r4 have suble and major differences besides just OD. adapter plates and gear ratios. case in point ....
===== help: haha i believe the chevy 350 fits better in my Olds Cutlass than the GM 200r4 in terms of straight swap,no adapter needed. True? not true? because my notes say thats true. haha go figure.
if someone could please tell me if im right about my transmission so i dont use a different repair manual and wonder why i have extra screws at the end, id appreciate it.
3) CONSENSUS FROM THE FORUM re MY DIAGNOSTICS AND SOLUTION: DETAILS of INCIDENT: I was on the freeway having just left for work when white smoke began to fill the cab with white smoke. My first thought was electrical fire. immediately pull over, investigate (IE rip my dash off) no fire. Open the hood and look down below, i find the culprit... ATF fluid basically FLOWING out (sudden massive fluid loss, like a catastrophic part failure, not failure drawn out over time.) right where the engine and transmission meet and pouring on to the Catalytic converter (the white smoke). Here is where it gets foggy for me. After putting in a spare quart of ATF i had in the trunk and limpimg home, i parked her and she sat for 3 days. I turned her on at that time and NO GEARS WHATSOEVER engaged. BUT... then i rechecked the Transmission dipstick and it showed i almost had TOO MUCH ATF but I know the puddle i left on the side of the road was considerable. Even so much that there HAD to be some indication of less ATF even if just for the size of the puddle. And before you ask, i have NOT added ATF recently (id probably say over a year) where OVERFILLING might be considered the cause of "too much" pressure, thereby rupturing a seal leading to the sudden fluid loss and no gears.
With that said, and after doing my research and reviewing available info on forums, sites,etc. ive concluded its the front pump seal that needs to be replaced.
But HOW to do this is where opinions really start to vary. Some say just change the seal. some transmission places say all seals need to be done along w torque converter and pump, or the seal will just blow again. Some others (dealerships mainly) say i need an ENTIRE rebuild (both front and back).
so i ask the ever wise Gbodyforum... what do you guys think is the best solution and what specific methods or protocols MUST be adhered to for successful rebuild? (I.E. methodology, tips or tricks not written in repair manual etc but vital to success)
is my conclusion correct about the front pump seal?
IF so, do i...?
+ just replace the seal,
+replace all seals, torque converter and front pump at the same time.
+do total rebuild?
Ive had the car long enough that i Feel comfortable with the emissions, Carb, CCC, etc. (learning how to chip her and tune her is next) and I rebuilt the carb myself first try with good success so I will definitely pay attention to detail being that its my first ever attempt at rebuilding a transmission.
BUT... My ride is an 84 and i need to be realistic. if i cant get her to pass smog this year, coupled with the cost of rebuild transmission, (even with me DIY) puts me in a bad spot financially so i get one shot at this. Any advice, nuggets of info, or knowledge RE: 200c Metric transmission rebuild would be GREATLY appreciated.
Sorry for the length of this post. Trust me I really debated posting this because I have been so overwhelmed the last 2 weeks, but truth is my family and i need this car. So its with great humility that i thank any and all here at gbodyforum in advance for for your considerations. thanks again and god bless.
"...Fortune favors the Brave."
-Latin Proverb
Arsan4000
