stock style front lower control arm/ coilover reinforcement plates?

[L05edSS]

as many may or may not know i am about to go thru a full suspension replacement with STD aldan's gbody kit for lowering. there's this "controversy" over these plates in a way from my months long research there is none except maybe 2-3 posts i seen on gbodyforum (wish i'd of bookmarked em). point 1 aldan is only co that make's them for their products and if you seen em they look weak & breakable yet cost around $60. i emailed them bout them and if in the kit i bought. " The front/rear G-Body kits we make do not include the optional ALD-39 lower control arm spacer plates (These are sold separately)"

all the video installs of qa1, aldan, viking, ridetech using stamp steel LCAs A & G bodies not 1 used such a thing. i asked multiple ppl and they all said same thing 'never had a problem', these were on vids older than 4 yrs using OEM equip. the posts i refered to say stock LCAs too weak.

my sometimes small brain would agree with that then i get thinkin... the T bar extends over the edges of that center cone where there's a verticel (sorta) support and if were to add a 1/4" steel plate that has no other support than the 2 bolts, could this create a rockin/ slide situation during suspension travel and a potential mid term major failure? if to go with plates this would prolly be better choice. YES i bought these but am conflicted, they feel like if were to use wheel spacers.

SSM COILOVER REINFORCEMENT PLATES

Coil-Over MountsSold in sets of 2. These plates built and designed by SSM offer the perfect landing for your coil-overs. The new muscle car coilover conversions offered by the spring companies use the lower shock t bar mount to support the entire weight of your car on a spot that was not...

southsidemachineperformance.com

aldan version. https://www.jegs.com/i/Aldan-American-Shocks/038/ALD-39/10002/-1

aldan kit i got.

1978-1988 Cutlass Aldan American Single Adjustable Full Coil-Over Kit, Small Block

1978-1988 Cutlass Aldan American Single Adjustable Full Coil-Over Kit, Small Block

www.ss396.com

 

[Sweet_Johnny]

I'm having trouble here, please clarify. Are you asking if you could attach the coilover plate on top of the control arm, sandwiched between it and the coilover and use only the factory bolts to hold it all? I wouldn't. That plate would need to be welded in for me to be comfortable driving it on the street, especially with passengers. Sure, you can use Loc-Tite, lock nuts, or safety wire (hell, use pins if ya want) to help the 2 shock bolts stay in place but you're trying to hold back the pressure of a spring. A strong one that used to have its force spread around a much larger spring pocket. I can't say for certain that it WILL slide around but it's definitely not the right way nor is it a place I'd want to invite trouble.

Anecdotal evidence ("never had a problem") is meaningless when it comes to something that can fail for no reason and kill you or others. The Hindenburg didn't have a problem until it burst into flames. Your aftermarket C.A.s are a different metal composition and slightly different thickness than stock, the stamping may have an imperfection, etc. etc.. so it's not an exact apples to apples comparison. Those people have no clue if the mounting point is flexing and moving while they drive down the road either. I bet they don't inspect every inch of the C.A. with a high powered light looking for cracks on a regular basis so their opinion is meaningless in regards to your safety. The point is that it's possible for the metal to flex enough to tear and the coilover to essentially disappear, collapsing the suspension on that side. It has happened. Ever seen a vehicle lose a tie rod at speed? Imagine losing your shock and spring- where does the tire go? What happens to steering?

Aside from that, those are fasteners that I'd be checking multiple times even if everything was installed "by the book". The adjustment on the coils needs to be checked as well- there's a lot of force being contained and things can get loose or be forgotten in the first place.

I run 1" wheel spacers out back and have removed the wheels more than once in the last 6 months for the sole purpose of checking the inner lug nuts. I take risks that nobody else would and seem to pull miracles out of my *ss at times but can't pedal a car with the landing gear folded up.

When it comes to brakes, steering, and suspension safety there should NEVER, ever be a question or doubt. Be safe bro, we like having you around.

 

[Rt Jam]

Buy the plates. From an engineering perspective, never had a problem means nothing at the DIY level.
I feel the same way about omitting the slip joint in a steering shaft and solid rear control arm bushings.

If a manufacturer like Toyota said we sold over a million Camry's and never had a problem, I would listen.

The plate spreads the load. An absolute necessity over 2 bolts which were originally designed to hold a shock absorber. The only downside is the cost and a minor weight gain.

 

[L05edSS]

I'm having trouble here, please clarify. Are you asking if you could attach the coilover plate on top of the control arm, sandwiched between it and the coilover and use only the factory bolts to hold it all? I wouldn't. That plate would need to be welded in for me to be comfortable driving it on the street, especially with passengers. Sure, you can use Loc-Tite, lock nuts, or safety wire (hell, use pins if ya want) to help the 2 shock bolts stay in place but you're trying to hold back the pressure of a spring. A strong one that used to have its force spread around a much larger spring pocket. I can't say for certain that it WILL slide around but it's definitely not the right way nor is it a place I'd want to invite trouble.

pretty much as you said, i have the plates and looking at how they're supposed to go looks like a disaster ready to happen cuz the plates extend the open area length of the 2 bolts vs being bolted straight to the control arms (for lack of better words). i tried finding failures aside from asking others and cant find any. i put this up to create discussion and previously in early posts here i made inquiring about coilovers if any issues or regular maintenance to beware of and got nothing in response.

we also live in a litigious society where everything has a warning label and have yet to see any of these companies of such products have a warning of some kind except for drag racing use such & such control arms i think was from viking.

 

[L05edSS]

Buy the plates. From an engineering perspective, never had a problem means nothing at the DIY level.
I feel the same way about omitting the slip joint in a steering shaft and solid rear control arm bushings.

If a manufacturer like Toyota said we sold over a million Camry's and never had a problem, I would listen.

The plate spreads the load. An absolute necessity over 2 bolts which were originally designed to hold a shock absorber. The only downside is the cost and a minor weight gain.

i get that about spreading the load, i just take issue with how the plates are just to be slipped in there with no other support but the 2 bolts? that looks real sketchy, do you have this setup?

 

[Clone TIE Pilot]

pretty much as you said, i have the plates and looking at how they're supposed to go looks like a disaster ready to happen cuz the plates extend the open area length of the 2 bolts vs being bolted straight to the control arms (for lack of better words). i tried finding failures aside from asking others and cant find any. i put this up to create discussion and previously in early posts here i made inquiring about coilovers if any issues or regular maintenance to beware of and got nothing in response.

we also live in a litigious society where everything has a warning label and have yet to see any of these companies of such products have a warning of some kind except for drag racing use such & such control arms i think was from viking.

You use longer than stock bolts to make up the difference. Still I would weld the plates in.

 

[Sweet_Johnny]

pretty much as you said, i have the plates and looking at how they're supposed to go looks like a disaster ready to happen cuz the plates extend the open area length of the 2 bolts vs being bolted straight to the control arms (for lack of better words). i tried finding failures aside from asking others and cant find any. i put this up to create discussion and previously in early posts here i made inquiring about coilovers if any issues or regular maintenance to beware of and got nothing in response.

we also live in a litigious society where everything has a warning label and have yet to see any of these companies of such products have a warning of some kind except for drag racing use such & such control arms i think was from viking.

It might be perfectly fine to just slip them in and call it good, I'm certainly no expert. I'm just a little put off by the thought of a suspension part that big being used as a glorified washer for a 450# spring, and I prefer to make fasteners a one-handed ordeal whenever possible. Weld that sucker in, but drill the bolt holes out bigger and weld in threaded inserts like Coupler Nuts first. Or use Rivnuts if possible. Then you eliminate the extra long bolts as well as the need to mess with nuts on top of the C.A.. You could just weld regular/ flange nuts on top of the plate but I believe you'd prefer the shortest bolt possible. Grinding some nuts to be round, slipping them in and welding is also an option I guess.

Riv-Nut & M8 bolt:



The knurling (which collapses) on these particular ones is 3/8" tall which is enough for the 3/16" plate on my Speedway arms but may not be enough to get through a factory arm as well as a 1/4" plate.

Coupler Nut:

 

[L05edSS]

It might be perfectly fine to just slip them in and call it good, I'm certainly no expert. I'm just a little put off by the thought of a suspension part that big being used as a glorified washer for a 450# spring, and I prefer to make fasteners a one-handed ordeal whenever possible. Weld that sucker in, but drill the bolt holes out bigger and weld in threaded inserts like Coupler Nuts first. Or use Rivnuts if possible. Then you eliminate the extra long bolts as well as the need to mess with nuts on top of the C.A.. You could just weld regular/ flange nuts on top of the plate but I believe you'd prefer the shortest bolt possible. Grinding some nuts to be round, slipping them in and welding is also an option I guess.

Riv-Nut & M8 bolt:

View attachment 239948

The knurling (which collapses) on these particular ones is 3/8" tall which is enough for the 3/16" plate on my Speedway arms but may not be enough to get through a factory arm as well as a 1/4" plate.

Coupler Nut:

View attachment 239949
View attachment 239950

i'm 100% with you on the glorified washer thing, that's how aldan markets it in this video and they're using them with tubulars. i will be addressing this with my mechanic i believe he's done quite a few of these.

 

[64nailhead]

I welded mine in and it was a no brainer to weld them based on my application.

A couple of things to consider about these plates and coil over conversions in general. Many coil over conversions get very little daily driving use - kind of a show car thing. They are rarely in rough terrain on poor roads. And many that complete a coil over conversion do not use the factory lower arms, but rather an arm designed to take the weight of the front corner on the plate for the lower coil over mount. Next, installing this plate raises the car, and not 1/8 -1/4". So the end user is installing a lowering kit, to lower the car obviously, and then installs these plates that essentially raise it back up 1/2" or more - seems contradictory, eh?

The purpose of these plates is safety as far as I'm concerned. GM never intended to carry the front corner weight of the car on area of the shock bolts, but rather the area where the front spring rides. Hence, the reason for my mention that it's a no brainer to use them. And I feel the reason that they are not sold by most every vendor is both the ease to make your own, or those that are swapping lower a-arms as part of a front end kit that includes the coil overs.

 

[Rt Jam]

i get that about spreading the load, i just take issue with how the plates are just to be slipped in there with no other support but the 2 bolts? that looks real sketchy, do you have this setup?

Other support is not necessary. The coil over bar sits on the new plate. The plate spreads the load. The 2 bolts hold it all in place. Once the weight of the car and the pressure from the spring are present. It's all loaded up.