Delay wipers fix maybe

[random_farmhick]

So I might have figured out a way to get delay wipers in a gbody, or have a work around for the cover that’s made of unobtainium for the factory delay. I started with the work that Wageslave did using a Pontiac Bonneville wiper motor that he never got it working correctly. Well I took a wiper motor off of the inlaws junk 04 bonneville and started doing some testing, and I got the same results as he did. I tried several different things before coming up with one that worked. I ordered a wiper switch for an 86 c10 with delay wipers(should work for 85-91 squarebodies even thought 88-91 show different part numbers). Then I tested which wires I would need, found that only one set of wires would vary resistance and of course they didn’t have power, so I put the one side to 12 volt. Oh and I had to completely repin the connector because they are all different too… Black wire on the wiper switch is 12 volt, and I used brown/white for 12 volt too to vary the resistance. Then I used gray switch to gray harness, brown switch to green harness, purple to purple, and pink to pink. Then on the motor end it was purple to purple, pink goes to washer motor, green harness to blue motor. Now you need a 24k ohm resistor on the brown or blue wire depending on which end that you put it, and a diode between the blue or brown(once again depending on which end you put it) and the pink wire so the wiper motor will run in the mist or wash position and not run the washer pump with the motor running. I’m going to put the washer pump on a relay so I don’t have to worry about the diode being heavy enough to carry the load. Only thing I can really see that doesn’t work 100% is sometimes when you go straight from low or high to off the wipers cycle a couple of times yet. In delay they cycle from about 1 second, to about 20 seconds, where my 04 silverado does from about 1 second to 12 seconds, most likely because the resistance isn’t quite the same as a Bonneville switch. I picked up a chevy venture wiper motor to try to get the hidden park, but while it “worked” with the Bonneville switch when I first tried it, it decided it wasn’t even going to work correctly with that today, so most likely I shorted something out in the module. I’m a long ways from getting it in my El Camino, but maybe it might help someone else get it in. I don’t think its that bad to change the wiper switch in the column. Here is a link to the posts that has some other information about actually mounting the motor and what got me going with it. https://gbodyforum.com/threads/delay-wipers.76905/page-4
Now the worst part of this whole thing, is my delay works perfect as of right now with the original cover.…

Link to a video that I made.

 

[Wageslave]

If that switch will mount in the column, that could be a pretty good fix, and it looks REALLY close in pictures.

The Venture motor may have given you problems if the body of the motor was not grounded. Some of them can run in reverse and jam themselves if the body isn't electrically grounded. I haven't had it happen to me, but apparently it happens often enough that they put warning stickers on new ones about it.

As far as the wiper parking, I haven't found a variant of this motor that does the reverse parking rotation and does not use the cam action crank arm (CACA, lol). This cam action crank arm relies on a timing tab to decouple the end of the arm from the motion of the motor when it is in reverse to pull the wiper arms down. In theory, it would not be a terribly hard system to retrofit but I don't think the parking motion in the new motor could be used directly with the G-Body linkages without that CACA due to the differences in rotational degrees it travels in reverse. I think the G-Body motor used something like 180 degrees and the newer motor uses about 270 degrees.

If one wanted to retrofit the CACA onto the G-Body linkage, you would have to replace the bigger pivot ball with the smaller one from an S-10 arm or the original G-Body arm, then add a timing tab to contact the CACA when it starts the reverse motion. The tab could be as simple or complex as you would want to make it, but the area around the motor mount plate lends itself to adding things like that in without any clearance issues. Being able to see a working system in a vehicle would give you a pretty good idea of where to begin and show you roughly where in the rotation the timing tab should hit at.

 

[random_farmhick]

If that switch will mount in the column, that could be a pretty good fix, and it looks REALLY close in pictures.

The Venture motor may have given you problems if the body of the motor was not grounded. Some of them can run in reverse and jam themselves if the body isn't electrically grounded. I haven't had it happen to me, but apparently it happens often enough that they put warning stickers on new ones about it.

As far as the wiper parking, I haven't found a variant of this motor that does the reverse parking rotation and does not use the cam action crank arm (CACA, lol). This cam action crank arm relies on a timing tab to decouple the end of the arm from the motion of the motor when it is in reverse to pull the wiper arms down. In theory, it would not be a terribly hard system to retrofit but I don't think the parking motion in the new motor could be used directly with the G-Body linkages without that CACA due to the differences in rotational degrees it travels in reverse. I think the G-Body motor used something like 180 degrees and the newer motor uses about 270 degrees.

If one wanted to retrofit the CACA onto the G-Body linkage, you would have to replace the bigger pivot ball with the smaller one from an S-10 arm or the original G-Body arm, then add a timing tab to contact the CACA when it starts the reverse motion. The tab could be as simple or complex as you would want to make it, but the area around the motor mount plate lends itself to adding things like that in without any clearance issues. Being able to see a working system in a vehicle would give you a pretty good idea of where to begin and show you roughly where in the rotation the timing tab should hit at.

The switch will fit in the column, because the bowl is the same from a square body to a g body, to anything else that uses that style of column, including some jeeps. The venture/montana motor was working correctly to start with when I was using the bonneville switch, but just wasn't working the other day after I got the new switch, so who knows, I might have shorted it out and damaged something. If I pushed the motor to get it started moving it would keep going, and as soon as I put power to it a relay was clicking inside the module.
I'm not too worried about the CACA, because I know I can do some fabrication already. If I measured correctly, the difference in the "circle" from park to normal operation is 0.424" and the venture arm is about 0.800", but I "think" that if I play where the tab hits I can make it work, but I won't know until I get a known good motor to make sure that the switch will run it correctly too.
To make things even more interesting, I think if I can find the correct length of wiper arms, I'll be able to upgrade the arms to the newer style of hook arms instead of the pins, but once again it'll take some machine work to use them. I'll keep people informed about my findings and hopefully give people hope for either adding delay wipers or keeping delay wipers after the module goes out. If everything works out, I'll make a template for drilling the holes for mounting the motor and uploading it.

 

[86LK]

I'll be able to upgrade the arms to the newer style of hook arms instead of the pins,

are you referring to J-hooks? there are large and small J-hooks. have you been looking at the chevy arms to see if you can fit them on the splined wiper mounts?

 

[random_farmhick]

are you referring to J-hooks? there are large and small J-hooks. have you been looking at the chevy arms to see if you can fit them on the splined wiper mounts?

Yeah I'm talking about the J hooks, where the wiper blade attaches to the arm is what I'm going to look at doing. I think I figured it out, but need to find an arm that's about an inch shorter than what I have, so a trip to the junkyard I need to make, for both that and I found out that when I had an engine fire back in 2002 it melted an cracked the one wiper shaft pivot, so I need to get an assembly. When I get it figured out, i'll let people know if it worked or not. The other thing with going to the newer wiper arms is the washer nozzle's will be in the arms, compared to the cowl, but of course I already bought new nozzles

 

[random_farmhick]

So if anyone is paying attention here, I have some updates. I got a pontiac montana/chevy venture wiper motor, and can't really get it to work at all except for high and low, so thought I would get a 2000 monte carlo motor because they are hidden wipers too, and I did get somewhere there though. On the square body wiper switch I can get everything to work except for park, it just wants to be in standby position... Then with the 86 elcamino wiper switch I can get everything to work except for wash and mist... I think I'm going to have to figure out exactly where I need to put either a diode or relay to make them work. I'm determined to get something that will help others in the future. If I can't get anywhere farther with them though, I know the 03 bonneville motor will work except for the hidden park, and honestly that's not a huge deal to me anyways, but someone with something such as a grand national I'm sure it would be.

 

[Wageslave]

Another suggestion for the switch might be from a 2000 Chevrolet Kodiak. It is new enough to be designed for this style of wiper motor so no extra diodes or resistors are necessary. It is also an application where non-tilt columns are still available. I may swap the 2000 Bonneville motor back in and try again with that switch, at some point.

 

[pagrunt]

Another suggestion for the switch might be from a 2000 Chevrolet Kodiak. It is new enough to be designed for this style of wiper motor so no extra diodes or resistors are necessary. It is also an application where non-tilt columns are still available. I may swap the 2000 Bonneville motor back in and try again with that switch, at some point.

That non tilt pulse application is used in '88-'94 C/K pick up's, '92-'94 C/K SUV's, '92 G vans, '92-'94 S SUV (nothing for the S pickup), '90-'93 Lumina APV (nothing for the other APV's), & of course '91-'02 Kodiaks.

 

[random_farmhick]

Another suggestion for the switch might be from a 2000 Chevrolet Kodiak. It is new enough to be designed for this style of wiper motor so no extra diodes or resistors are necessary. It is also an application where non-tilt columns are still available. I may swap the 2000 Bonneville motor back in and try again with that switch, at some point.

I thought about that, but they use the same one as 88-98 pickups, and the wiring for that is different. Its very similar to the 80's to early 90's s10's, which I had one of those switches here and couldn't do anything because of the power. I think the pickups/kodiaks just look for the resistance of the switch, not variable voltages like the g body, bonneville, monte carlos's. I've wanted to get back on to this project, but I've got too much work to get done before spring planting that my "toys" get pushed to the back burner.

 

[random_farmhick]

Now I remember after posting it, wash, there is nowhere on the switch for the washer pump, it's all run through the module on the wiper motor on the 80's-90's s10's and pickups. So while I could get the low/high/delay to work, it would have to have a separate switch somewhere for the washer pump motor.