200R4 or turbo350?
- Thread starter Tuggy24g
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and my old boss has a 6sec 200+mph drag car running a th350. it sure as hell ain't stock though! look at ckperformance and you'll find 800hp cars running 200r4's. i see plenty of cars with 700r4's, 4l60e, 4l80es and 200r4's running well over 500hp/tq.
i know you old timers love the th400 but there are other options.
i know you old timers love the th400 but there are other options.
I know us "old timers" know nothing and you young kids think you know it all! This post isn't for you it is for Tuggy24g and he has 2 transmission's and i am just suggesting which transmission i would use for his application,, not yours!
You obviously never owned a Th350 or TH400 or you would know how strong they really are!!
You obviously never owned a Th350 or TH400 or you would know how strong they really are!!
Depends on your budget and what you want to use the car for. A TH350 is obviously far cheaper to build and fairly strong in stock form, but the lack of OD really hurts depending on your gears. Perfect for a mostly track car, but otherwise, the extra gas and added engine wear isn't worth the upfront savings.
A 200-4R is a great trans and can be built to handle a LOT of power, but will cost you more to build. For a street car, I personally wouldn't run any other auto trans.
For reference, in my 84 SS with a TH350c (w/ lockup) and 3.42's I ran about 3500 RPM at 75mph. In my 85, when it had the 200-4R and 3.73 gears it only ran at 2500rpm. When my 85 had a TH350 in it, I got about 10mpg if I was lucky - I could more than double that after I installed the 200-4R. RPM was not even streetable IMHO...
A 200-4R is a great trans and can be built to handle a LOT of power, but will cost you more to build. For a street car, I personally wouldn't run any other auto trans.
For reference, in my 84 SS with a TH350c (w/ lockup) and 3.42's I ran about 3500 RPM at 75mph. In my 85, when it had the 200-4R and 3.73 gears it only ran at 2500rpm. When my 85 had a TH350 in it, I got about 10mpg if I was lucky - I could more than double that after I installed the 200-4R. RPM was not even streetable IMHO...
If they both can be built to handle the power then strength is not the issue. Cost and use is. OK what is the benefits of the 200-4R to weigh against the extra cost of a suitable performance build. With a 3 speed you either gear the car for mileage and cruising like 84GP has or you gear for acceleration and just pay the price with wear, and fuel if you want to cruise. With the 200-4r you can gear for maximum acceleration then use overdrive and the lock-up converter for cruising or saveing wear on your expensive motor and fuel. How much? About 1/3 more mileage and 1/3 less rpm in top gear.
I have a performance street gbody. I would not say it even qualifies as a street strip setup as its too mild. I run a 509ci motor with a firm but not harsh shifting street strip built 200-4r. I added the billet drum/shaft because of the crazy low end torque and the use of large drag radials. It would cost you about $1,500 to do this probably twice what it would cost to do the th350. I am gearing my car with a 3.73 rear and a 29" tire because in the top of third gear with the converter locked 500HP would push my 3,800LB car through the traps at 115mph at 5,000 rpms which is just past max HP for my motor. This way the car is geared for maximum acceleration at the 1/4 mile. Now the other side of the coin. In overdrive it turns the rear at 67% of your final drive or rear gears ie it would be the same as haveing a 2.49 rear end. Add the benefit of a no slip converter which saves another 300 rpm or so. You could say you get to have your cake and eat it to.
In its prior configuration (3.42 gear & a 28" tire) without carberation or timeing adjustments it ran 110mph and got 17.0 MPG HWY in the same trim as it left the track. Is it worth the extra investment depends on your budget and goals. I totaled my daily driver and this car got pushed into regular service for a while. I put 9,000 miles on the car in a little over a year before I had a lady pull out in front of me makeing my first Cutlass an economic total. Many people don't have the extra budget, and most people don't put say more than 5,000 miles a year on their "project" car. But it sure is enjoyable and fun haveing a car that effortlessly cruises (no buzzing your big block) down the interstate in the fast lane knocking down decent mileage AND having great ok good stop light or 1/4 mile performance.
Edit: One more thing with the lock up converters you can have a higher stall converter say 3,000 that still lock up for no slip no heat when going down the highway. Yes I know you can get lock up converters for a th350 but few do as they under estimate the value even when they are bulding a car that would benefit from it.
I have a performance street gbody. I would not say it even qualifies as a street strip setup as its too mild. I run a 509ci motor with a firm but not harsh shifting street strip built 200-4r. I added the billet drum/shaft because of the crazy low end torque and the use of large drag radials. It would cost you about $1,500 to do this probably twice what it would cost to do the th350. I am gearing my car with a 3.73 rear and a 29" tire because in the top of third gear with the converter locked 500HP would push my 3,800LB car through the traps at 115mph at 5,000 rpms which is just past max HP for my motor. This way the car is geared for maximum acceleration at the 1/4 mile. Now the other side of the coin. In overdrive it turns the rear at 67% of your final drive or rear gears ie it would be the same as haveing a 2.49 rear end. Add the benefit of a no slip converter which saves another 300 rpm or so. You could say you get to have your cake and eat it to.
In its prior configuration (3.42 gear & a 28" tire) without carberation or timeing adjustments it ran 110mph and got 17.0 MPG HWY in the same trim as it left the track. Is it worth the extra investment depends on your budget and goals. I totaled my daily driver and this car got pushed into regular service for a while. I put 9,000 miles on the car in a little over a year before I had a lady pull out in front of me makeing my first Cutlass an economic total. Many people don't have the extra budget, and most people don't put say more than 5,000 miles a year on their "project" car. But it sure is enjoyable and fun haveing a car that effortlessly cruises (no buzzing your big block) down the interstate in the fast lane knocking down decent mileage AND having great ok good stop light or 1/4 mile performance.
Edit: One more thing with the lock up converters you can have a higher stall converter say 3,000 that still lock up for no slip no heat when going down the highway. Yes I know you can get lock up converters for a th350 but few do as they under estimate the value even when they are bulding a car that would benefit from it.
As the original post said a stock trans, the TH350 is stronger in dead stock form than the Th200 4R. Either transmission can be built to handle the power, but stock the TH 350 is better for a big block.
Agreed.
I will say that I see all too many times people put a lot of time and money into their motors, and put it in front of a stock, or used transmission. Why cut a corner like this? I personally wouldn't want the risk, plus it'd be lame to take it back out.
I'll share a quick story about myself. When I first got my 442, I beat the unholy crap out of it. Too many brake stands and other shenanigans took it's toll, and one day I was rompin on the car, the trans slipped at the 1-2 shift at WOT and the 307 spun past 6000 rpm, and that was all it took. That was how the 307 met its maker, because my stock transmission sliped. And this was a stock H.O. 307 with headers and true duals, that's it. If a stock 307 can nuke a 200-4R, you can bet a built 396 will.
Instead of hoping that one of two used trannys you have available will be good enough, why not just do it up right, so you don't have to worry about it? I think it'd be worth it in the long run...
I will say that I see all too many times people put a lot of time and money into their motors, and put it in front of a stock, or used transmission. Why cut a corner like this? I personally wouldn't want the risk, plus it'd be lame to take it back out.
I'll share a quick story about myself. When I first got my 442, I beat the unholy crap out of it. Too many brake stands and other shenanigans took it's toll, and one day I was rompin on the car, the trans slipped at the 1-2 shift at WOT and the 307 spun past 6000 rpm, and that was all it took. That was how the 307 met its maker, because my stock transmission sliped. And this was a stock H.O. 307 with headers and true duals, that's it. If a stock 307 can nuke a 200-4R, you can bet a built 396 will.
Instead of hoping that one of two used trannys you have available will be good enough, why not just do it up right, so you don't have to worry about it? I think it'd be worth it in the long run...
Well with me money is tight and my buddy mechanic said it would be cheaper to stick with the stock one for right now. I would like something else beside a 200-4r, but then your talking about changing cross members and other stuff that I really do not have funds for right now.
With the question about th350 and 200r4 just wanted to know if the guy was bull ******** me or now.
thanks for the help guys
Brad
With the question about th350 and 200r4 just wanted to know if the guy was bull ******** me or now.
thanks for the help guys
Brad
In all honesty, the swap you propose is not cheap to do right. The stock crossmember is set up for a single exhaust and that will choke the life out of a more powerful engine. That's just the first problem. The fuel line is too small from the tank pickup all the way to the front if you want to feed a decent amount of horsepower, etc.
Well I am running duel exhaust. Also I am changing the fuel lines out today. I also just got my heads in. So everything is coming together nicely.
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