LS Disappointment?
- Thread starter fleming442
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Yeah, but those aren't "electrical issues" unless they were self-inflicted from incorrect wiring or expecting a 150,000 mile junkyard engine to work like a new crate engine. The sensors are consumables at that point, just like rings and bearings.
I am certainly not disappointed with my LS swap.
The best part about LS stuff is that stuff is available. 50 year old complete good olds, pontiac, buick and GOOD chevy stuff is not exactly plentiful anymore. I searched for 4 years to find my forged 425 olds crank for a reasonable price local, and still have yet to find the DX block or all the other stuff. I found my 6.0 longblock for $200, 317 heads shipped for $75, d585 heatsink coils for $40, ect.
My olds build is going to leak oil out the valve covers, require custom brackets to get a serpentine belt, require custom building an intake and fuel rails, an expensive standalone EFI system, and still have the chance to spin bearings because its an olds.
The LS is a worn out oil field truck engine that has been making 550hp with a blower and cam for 2 years on all factory rotating parts.
AN LS swap CAN be expensive if you let it and pay everyone to "do it right the first time" but in reality it costs just as much to "do it right the first time" for anything else. A "good looking" ls car water pump system or something from lssimple or itc-billet is going to cost what you would pay for a good new SBC serpentine setup.
What you spend in motor mounts and hoses to get a LS in is what you would spend in AFR or something aluminum cylinder heads that flow what an LS does.
And comparing your aluminum headed 350 with a carb is not comparable to a 5.3 with efi. You have to compare EFI to EFI. Most if not all the aftermarket EFI systems for a SBC blow you out of the water for budget when comparing SBC to LS.
LS isn't the best, it's just a piece of plastic, copper, steel and aluminum that pumps air through it and combines with some angry electrons and fuel to make a spinny force. The fact that it makes more spinny force per cubic inch than other models doesnt make it better and it doesnt mean others are worse, its just a way to do what you want.
The best part about LS stuff is that stuff is available. 50 year old complete good olds, pontiac, buick and GOOD chevy stuff is not exactly plentiful anymore. I searched for 4 years to find my forged 425 olds crank for a reasonable price local, and still have yet to find the DX block or all the other stuff. I found my 6.0 longblock for $200, 317 heads shipped for $75, d585 heatsink coils for $40, ect.
My olds build is going to leak oil out the valve covers, require custom brackets to get a serpentine belt, require custom building an intake and fuel rails, an expensive standalone EFI system, and still have the chance to spin bearings because its an olds.
The LS is a worn out oil field truck engine that has been making 550hp with a blower and cam for 2 years on all factory rotating parts.
AN LS swap CAN be expensive if you let it and pay everyone to "do it right the first time" but in reality it costs just as much to "do it right the first time" for anything else. A "good looking" ls car water pump system or something from lssimple or itc-billet is going to cost what you would pay for a good new SBC serpentine setup.
What you spend in motor mounts and hoses to get a LS in is what you would spend in AFR or something aluminum cylinder heads that flow what an LS does.
And comparing your aluminum headed 350 with a carb is not comparable to a 5.3 with efi. You have to compare EFI to EFI. Most if not all the aftermarket EFI systems for a SBC blow you out of the water for budget when comparing SBC to LS.
LS isn't the best, it's just a piece of plastic, copper, steel and aluminum that pumps air through it and combines with some angry electrons and fuel to make a spinny force. The fact that it makes more spinny force per cubic inch than other models doesnt make it better and it doesnt mean others are worse, its just a way to do what you want.
People could argue the same thing about rear axles too but nobody does, engines seem to envoke pride and brand loyalty but nobody cares about their transmission or rear axle.
Put a ford 302 or 5.0 coyote in a G body? Woah!!! Get ready to be burned at the stake!!
Put a ford 9" or 8.8 in a G body? Nice, you made a good axle choice!
Try to build up your stock 305 in a G body? Lukewarm perception is likely what you would get but I'd say overall supportive
Try to build up your stock 7.5 rear? Again, get ready to be burned at the stake!
Heck, I built my zr2 s10 8.6 rear for my G body which retains a lot of the stock GM parts like brake lines, e brake cables, GM bolt pattern, ect. What did I get? Mostly positive reception, but a good amount of people saying "Why didn't you built a 8.8 Ford or buy a 9"?" I think that goes to show people aren't brand loyal, they are loyal to what OTHER people tell them the should be loyal to. Brand loyalty to engines but total brand ignorance to axles makes me laugh.
And for everyone that says "LS swaps are played out", how are you loyal to SBC's, the most common engine built, staying in a car? I can understand if you had a turbo buick and swapped a LS in that because a turbo buick MAKES the car, but being mad that you removed a chevy, the most common engine ever installed in a G body, to install an LS which is arguably the LEAST common engine installed in a g body, how is that played out? Because the cars you SEE at shows have it done? I would think the pontiac 301 is the lowest production engine in a G body. Fact is GM put more pontiac engines in G bodies in a week of production in 1979 than humanity will ever swap into G bodies over the next century.
The truth of the matter is, a lot of people are upset for putting LS in BOP's and totally fine putting Ford axles in a GM. I believe that is one of those core humanity flukes we have. We aren't acutally loyal to what we think should go in, we are loyal to what other people tell people they should be loyal to. Happens to sports teams, politics, and even engines in 30-40 year old cars made by a multinational automotive manufacturing company.
Put a ford 302 or 5.0 coyote in a G body? Woah!!! Get ready to be burned at the stake!!
Put a ford 9" or 8.8 in a G body? Nice, you made a good axle choice!
Try to build up your stock 305 in a G body? Lukewarm perception is likely what you would get but I'd say overall supportive
Try to build up your stock 7.5 rear? Again, get ready to be burned at the stake!
Heck, I built my zr2 s10 8.6 rear for my G body which retains a lot of the stock GM parts like brake lines, e brake cables, GM bolt pattern, ect. What did I get? Mostly positive reception, but a good amount of people saying "Why didn't you built a 8.8 Ford or buy a 9"?" I think that goes to show people aren't brand loyal, they are loyal to what OTHER people tell them the should be loyal to. Brand loyalty to engines but total brand ignorance to axles makes me laugh.
And for everyone that says "LS swaps are played out", how are you loyal to SBC's, the most common engine built, staying in a car? I can understand if you had a turbo buick and swapped a LS in that because a turbo buick MAKES the car, but being mad that you removed a chevy, the most common engine ever installed in a G body, to install an LS which is arguably the LEAST common engine installed in a g body, how is that played out? Because the cars you SEE at shows have it done? I would think the pontiac 301 is the lowest production engine in a G body. Fact is GM put more pontiac engines in G bodies in a week of production in 1979 than humanity will ever swap into G bodies over the next century.
The truth of the matter is, a lot of people are upset for putting LS in BOP's and totally fine putting Ford axles in a GM. I believe that is one of those core humanity flukes we have. We aren't acutally loyal to what we think should go in, we are loyal to what other people tell people they should be loyal to. Happens to sports teams, politics, and even engines in 30-40 year old cars made by a multinational automotive manufacturing company.
I'm not sure about the 4.8s but I know that the Van's and some trucks that came with the 4.3 and 80e had higher stall converters.
Aside from my Ford 9in, I did exactly that. I haven't touched my suspension. It's got the same springs from the factory and shocks from who knows when. I know that hurts me in some areas. But it doesn't keep the car from making the power it does.
However, I will be upgrading them. So I'm not disagreeing with you there. But you can apply the trickle effect to any car with an upgraded engine and power adders.
What it all boils down to in my eyes is, the LS is a great starting platform. You get your foot in the door with a cheap engine that already has the things you need to handle power adders.
A strong bottom end, strong rods (and even stronger with the Gen 4s), great flowing heads, and a pretty damn good stock intake with nice long runners (if you go that route). You're hitting the ground running for sub 1k.
Hehe, I have read many comments regarding how LS swaps are "boring", done a gazillion times, "played out" or it's a "Chevy Engine" but the reality of it is no one cares, especially me. If I wanted to be unique I could have spent 20K on an Olds DX build with 442 cid but why spend that money on something that would under perform an LS build? Oh yea, its also been done before. The driver for most LS swaps is the leap from 50 year old technology, its a GM corporate platform, outstanding performance potential with great drivability, platform support and availability. I've noticed that many of those criticizing have not built an LS engine and know nothing more than what they read on line.
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When you pop the hood nobody usually can see your transmission or rear axle.
I'm still not happy about the modified Ford air cleaner flapper on the 69 H/O (and used on S/CRamblers. The end of the vacuum can actuator has the Ford logo stamped in the end of it. Demmer Engineering started all this crap and they should be driven out of business. Oh, wait.... 🙂
9" rears don't even belong in GM cars IMO. Parasitic losses are huge compared to the correct one. I understand why people do it, but nobody on the street really needs one. Walk up to 15 people on the street and tell them you have a 9" rear and they'll either 1) not give two craps or 2) look at you like there's something wrong with you- and still not give two craps.
LS swaps are neat in that if you add headers- plug in and tune a little, boom. Done. Swap cams? Not only is it cool that you can just rotate the cam and yank it out without removing lifters, but again, button it up, run it, tune it, boom. Done. Easy peasy.
Put what you want in your tub. I have no animosity toward swapping sh*t if you want to. Nobody has to approve but you. Just don't get so butthurt when someone says "you should have put a 455 in it." I appreciate the efforts of modified cars, but I really appreciate the efforts of someone going the extra mile to maintain their cars to a factory-original standpoint, or at least as close as possible. In some ways, that's harder to do.
It all comes down to setting what goal for your car you want, and how close you come to realizing that goal. Nothing more, nothing less.
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