To the Big 3 (help me format and fix blah before sending this off)

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You can still build "strippers" but usually you have to special-order them. I think theoretically, you can still get an F-150 XL with crank windows. Good luck finding them on a dealer lot, though. Pretty much even the basest of base models will usually have A/C, power windows, and at least an AM/FM stereo. I don't see how that's necessarily a bad thing. I mean, the only cars you can get more stripped than that are the COPO Camaros and the Drag Pak Challengers. But as far as I know, neither of those are technically street-legal.
 
I didn't think my one rant would gather 4 pages of comments. But you guys are right. I don't think the makers could make what I want due to regulations, though I feel half the regulations (not actual number, just saying) are completely worthless. Yes, some of the new tech is required (damn you TPMS sensors) but surely there is a better way. We live and breath octane. We turn wrenches. We find ways around the laws where need be. That spark plug adapter is supposed to be attached to my O2 sensor, trust me.
I know there is hurdles, but I still feel the auto manufacturers could make a better car. One for us, that doesn't have all the extra weight of built in iTunes, back up cameras, lane change assist....
Don't get me wrong, it's all good technology, but I don't wan't it. I'm the driver. Not the car. If i'm too dumb to drive, I deserve what I get.

Diagnostics are performed by trained technicians. The systems that the fault codes direct us to require some training and knowledge. The training doesn't have to be formal. It could be alot of reading on forums, social media, etc. but it has to be learned before any true understanding and accurate diagnostics are completed.

There are people out there that are doing this or have done it in the recent past. My best example is Matt Happel, aka Denmah. If you look into his early research and hands on, trial and error education, then you'll find it over on LS1tech, The Turbo Forum, and Yellow Bullet. Perhaps some other places as well. But look at what he (and many supporters) have accomplished as a 'hobby'! He can take a drivetrain from a less than 3 year old vehicle, transplant it into an older vehicle that can be inspected legally (at least in his state) and outrun anything from the previous generations 'fast cars'. I have used much of his info that he's supplied on his wiki page for my current build. The best part is he's given out this info for free - which defines him as true enthusiast IMHO.

More directly back to your topic, if you want simpler cars, then you need to convince the public to request them. I don't think you have a snowball's chance in hell of accomplishing that because of our population and societal mentality. When people were allowed to sue a manufacturer, and win, because their Explorer rolled over because they had flat tires (maintenance item) the writing was on the wall that the consumer had no responsibility to ensure their vehicle was safe. Both my and my wife's current daily driver have tire inflation sensors. Why? Because we are too ignorant to check the tire pressure. The same goes for oil change info. I don't need any of that garbage, but try finding a vehicle without it.

My brother ordered a 2004 Chevy 2500HD 2WD 6 speed standard with a Duramax, with rubber floor mats, cloth interior, and the only options were AM/FM and AC. It's been impossible to order the same since 2004 and that's the dilemma. BTW, he's had two different dealers offer him what he paid for that new as a trade value and it has 220K on it.
 
I didn't think my one rant would gather 4 pages of comments. But you guys are right. I don't think the makers could make what I want due to regulations, though I feel half the regulations (not actual number, just saying) are completely worthless. Yes, some of the new tech is required (damn you TPMS sensors) but surely there is a better way. We live and breath octane. We turn wrenches. We find ways around the laws where need be. That spark plug adapter is supposed to be attached to my O2 sensor, trust me.
I know there is hurdles, but I still feel the auto manufacturers could make a better car. One for us, that doesn't have all the extra weight of built in iTunes, back up cameras, lane change assist....
Don't get me wrong, it's all good technology, but I don't wan't it. I'm the driver. Not the car. If i'm too dumb to drive, I deserve what I get.
Say "Thank you, EPA."
A bigger problem is how society has become so reliant on technology. Bluetooth hands free, music synced off your device playing through the car radio, blind spot indicators, back up cameras, yada, yada, yada- most people would be completely lost without that kind of stuff.
A funny anecdote: a couple of months ago, I was travelling around the DC beltway (dangerous *ss road to begin with), and I see some fool running across 3 lanes with a safety vest and a jump box in his hand. As I get closer, there is a little, newer, foreign car on the left shoulder with the hood up and on the right shoulder is one of those AAA contractors in a minivan. The foreign car owner and the "technician" are both staring under the hood. Now, you and I both know that neither one knew WTF the were looking at given the situation. You're not going to just jump start a newer car that quit while driving, and expect it to move! :rofl:
 
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My wife is a teacher. About 10 years ago she took a group of kids to Wendy's as a reward for something. They all got in her car and none of the kids (4th graders) had ever been in a car with window cranks in the doors.
Last week I was unfortunately forced to ride with a 22 year old girl for a couple days for work. Literally could not go anywhere without Google maps...in her home town...including finding her way home. I'm not exagerating. She was completely lost. Needed turn by turn prompts to go anywhere.
 
Last week I was unfortunately forced to ride with a 22 year old girl for a couple days for work. Literally could not go anywhere without Google maps...in her home town...including finding her way home. I'm not exagerating. She was completely lost. Needed turn by turn prompts to go anywhere.
I still use paper maps for work to find out where I need to be/go to. They even help to find side roads that the GPS can't find. As for your co-worker, she should sue her school district for making her such a confident scholar of the world.
 
Nothing wrong with using maps or GPS. Was just pointing out that a lot of younger people are completely dependant an convenience/technology. She was a special kind of stupid. I'm not putting that on an entire generation
 
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. She was a special kind of stupid. I'm not putting that on an entire generation
I will!!!!
How many people can figure out which direction they need to go based on the sun or moon position in the sky? I might not be dead - on, but I ain't driving in circles, either.
 
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Just kill me . . . before this MF does! Haven't driven a 6 but drove a CTS to Texas and back and I had me some serious fun in that sucker. I was vaguely impressed. Why TF would I want autopilot?
Probably just as well I missed out on the first several pages . . . :doh:

 
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Last week I was unfortunately forced to ride with a 22 year old girl for a couple days for work. Literally could not go anywhere without Google maps...in her home town...including finding her way home. I'm not exagerating. She was completely lost. Needed turn by turn prompts to go anywhere.

I find this comment stunning and unfortunately too familiar. This defines an issue that seems to have become considered completely normal and acceptable. As Fleming mentioned, it's absolutely ridiculous. If the GPS told here to run over a closed bridge, then she'd do it and then sue the GPS manufacturer because she has no personal responsibility, in her mind. This girl probably has no idea how ignorant she is - the situation is very discouraging.
 
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Long *ss reply, you've been warned.

OP: Others have already poked holes in your letter and I don't really want to as well with 5 pages of comments but there are additional points that I think need to be put out there.

As jiho was explaining, the knock sensor isn't there to tell you that the rods are knocking & the engine needs to be replaced. It detects "knocking" aka pinging aka pre-ignition in the combustion chamber. And too much of that leads to a burnt hole in your piston. It can happen from too low octane gas, overall bad gas, too much timing advance, among other things. When it detects pinging it tells the computer to back off the timing. It also helps the computer to optimize the timing under normal circumstances. Kind of like having someone constantly twisting the distributor under the hood of an old school car to optimize timing. The car not running due to the failure of that sensor is probably a fail safe measure programmed into the computer. Now that you know what it does you know why the engine shouldn't run without it when the timing is reliant on it. I'd much rather have to deal with changing that failed sensor at 200k miles, (meaning possibly once over the entire life of the vehicle) than to deal with rebuilding/replacing an engine with a hole in the piston.

O2 sensors tell the computer whether the engine is rich or lean and the computer adjusts to maintain optimum air/fuel ratio. Can't do that with an old school carb.

You made a gripe about crumple zones. Why? In a major collision they absorb more of the impact so less is transferred into the passenger cabin & by default, your body. Sure, by design it weakens the structure of the car & causes way more damage in less severe collisions than older cars without crumple zones. Tends to render a car non repairable. Guess what? For the safety aspect of the major collision, I'll take a ****ed up car over a ****ed up body any day. I may be pissed that my newer car is destroyed but at least I'm alive to be able to be pissed off.

Those Chryslers with the battery in the fender... So what? Again, how often do you change a battery? My second to last vehicle was a 2006 GMC Envoy that I bought brand spanking new and traded in with exactly 280k miles on the nose. Replaced the battery once. Battery technology has gotten good enough that if you're replacing batteries often then you either have some other problem in the charging system that's eating batteries, or you're buying shitty batteries. For something that I might replace once during the life of the car, I don't care if I have to dig a bit to get at it.

On that same note... Who cares if the spark plugs are buried? Modern platinum plugs really do last 100k miles or better. I'd rather replace plugs that are a pain in the *ss once than easy plugs multiple times. So many things on cars nowadays don't require the attention as often that they used to. How often do you hear people bitching about power window motors going out on modern cars? They're far more reliable than the power window motors of the '70' & '80s. I love it whenever I get a new ride there's always someone who's going to tell me "that starter/alternator/gizmo/doohickey/whatever is a b*tch to get to." And my answer is "so f'n what? How often will I need to get to it?" As long as I can easily access the filters, the fluid check/fill/drain points, the fuses & relays... I'm good. Heck I don't even care about accessing any bulbs on my new truck because every single light is LED.

Here's the beauty of the sensors & computers & all of that "hard to work on" crap: Modern naturally aspirated 4 cylinder engines make the same or better power that V8s made 20-30 years ago while getting 2-3 times the fuel economy. That is what all those sensors making constant adjustments do. A byproduct of that is because the engine is constantly running efficiently you're not getting the various gunk buildups in various engine related systems. And the more efficiently & precise the engine runs the less that the EGR and the cat have to work to clean up the exhaust gases so those systems by default become more reliable. The only benefit of those systems is to pacify the government, but if there are other aspects of the car that make those systems better, than it's a win-win.

I also love the modern tech with OBD because while my buddy with the old school rig is spending day after day, weekend after weekend trying to figure out how to get rid of that stumble or hesitation or whatever, more often than not I can plug a code reader in and it'll tell me exactly what's wrong. Could be a sensor is reading something outside of the parameters therefore I can go straight to the problem and fix it, whether it be an actual problem or just that sensor went haywire.

My 2006 Envoy with 280k miles was traded in on a brand new 2014 F150 Ecoboost crew cab. I racked up 100k miles in 3 years (yes I drive a lot) so I traded that in on a brand new 2017 F150 Ecoboost crew cab last summer while the 2014 could still fetch good money. I love that little turbo 6 cylinder. It has power that'll rip the face right off of most V8s (including late model ones, not just older ones) and I can set the cruise at 70 and get 22 mpg. I love all the convenience tech it has... Bluetooth built in to the stereo, heated & cooled leather seats, adaptive cruise control, 1 touch down/up power windows, memory settings so my seat & mirrors go back EXACTLY where I had them if someone else drives my truck... Also the keys never leave my pocket, the doors unlock as soon as I touch the door handle & it's a push button start. Something else that's cool... I can remote start the ****er from an app on my phone so I can heat up/cool down the interior a few minutes before approaching the truck. It was pretty nice to start my truck from my phone as I was leaving a Seahawks game on a brutally cold day & have a toasty warm truck waiting for me. And no, the auto makers didn't condition me to want that stuff, I want that stuff on my own free will.

You can't buy a stripped down GM 2500 diesel with a manual transmission & no options besides A/C and a radio because almost nobody ****ing buys those anymore. That ONE dealer is probably willing to pay top dollar for that ONE stripped down truck because they have ONE farmer in coveralls who's willing to pay top dollar for such a truck should one ever come up for sale. That's the exception, not the norm. They don't make 3/4 ton Suburbans anymore because nobody ****ing buys those anymore either.

If any of you are still reading, here's the business side of things. No, the automakers aren't purposely making a car that only lasts 3-5 years so you'll come buy a new one. The average new car buyer only keeps a car on average 3-5 years. And they typically don't do their own work and typically bring it to the dealer. So they make a car that appeals to them. The second or later owner is more likely on average to keep the car longer, work on it themselves, or take it to an independent shop. So, be honest here... How many AC Delco boxes do you see in the trash can of the independent shops? And when you're buying a part on Rock Auto are you buying the $41.99 AC Delco part, or the $29.99 Brand X part? The factory parts are usually only bought out of necessity. (There's your reason why many parts are "dealer item only" for a few years after a new car is released. It's not that the Brand X part makers haven't "caught up" it's the OEMs not allowing them to manufacture those parts for the aftermarket for a period of time so they can get ROI on the development & launch of that car.) Here's the thing: The car manufacturers don't give 2 flying sh*ts about the shade tree mechanic. Because what the hell are you going to buy from them? How do they benefit from building your wet dream, simple to work on car? They'll get your warranty business and that's it. In the meantime for the maintenance items it's going to be Fram filters & etc from the parts store with the cheapest price, and once it's out of warranty, for the repair items it's also going to be Brand X parts from the parts store with the cheapest price. Those are the facts.

Some components are tough to get to because when you're building hundreds of thousands of vehicles you have to be as efficient as possible on the assembly line to maintain volumes as well as be price competitive. In nearly all cases the components that are tough to get to either rarely or never need to be accessed. People bitched like no tomorrow about how stupid it was on the 4th gen Camaros that you had to take the engine out from the bottom. Yeah? Point is...? How often is someone going to yard that engine out? The performance folks who are most likely to do so are a drop in the bucket of the buyer market. The catastrophic engine failures that will require engine removal are also just another drop in the bucket. Sure they can build the simple wet dream car with every component easily accessible but the assembly line rate will be so low as well as the volume of buyers, and those buyers aren't buying anything after the sale of the car anyway so their only chance to make money is on the initial sale of the car. Be prepared to pay $100k for that simple car. For that kind of money you can buy the complex car & pay someone to wrench on it.

Sorry for the long *ss post. But so many people sit there and give themselves brain aneurysms & heart attacks bitching about what auto makers could and should be doing without really looking at the brutal truth or the big picture. Or, making such directive about what the auto makers could and should be building with absolutely zero intention of buying that product should it become a reality. Look, I'm obviously an enthusiast (why else would I be on this forum?) But I grasp the realities and accept & embrace them.
 
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