liquidh8
Comic Book Super Hero
Worth rebuilding, I did mine in the wagon, as its a 442/SS/GN box.
Want To Rebuild Your Saginaw 800 series Steering Box?
- Thread starter 69hurstolds
- Start date
I have a new YA box I could use, but I think I'm going to rebuild the YA box that's in it. I've been waffling around for the last week trying to decide whether to rebuild and reuse my old box or just be lazy and plop on the NOS box. I'm going to try this again. It's been 200 years since I've piddled around with this thing.
I already had a Gates rebuild seal kit for the box, but it was the ones without the bearing. I also have a new adjuster bearing, so I bought both types for the pitman shaft. I got a Timken USA old school full needle bearing without the stop ledge, and also an SKF USA BH1250 bearing with the stop ledge. The only real reason for the ledge is to keep the bearing from walking up into the gear area. But considering it's super low turning speeds, and never even a single entire revolution, I don't think anyone's ever had that issue. School's still out on which one I'm going to use.
While I don't have a face spanner of the correct size for the adjuster nut, I honestly have never used one. No need to get that tool now. Not for this. As luck would have it, I do happen to have the K-M tools for bearing drivers and the ball bearing "corn cob" tool to keep the balls in the rack. I got these after-the-fact from doing my last steering box many years ago and I'm figuring it'll make reassembly a bit easier. After watching Hutch's videos with his 1/2" hose trick (pretty ingenious), I'm thinking I can do the same thing with the "corn cob" tool without having to use grease and get by with the PS fluid.
I already had a Gates rebuild seal kit for the box, but it was the ones without the bearing. I also have a new adjuster bearing, so I bought both types for the pitman shaft. I got a Timken USA old school full needle bearing without the stop ledge, and also an SKF USA BH1250 bearing with the stop ledge. The only real reason for the ledge is to keep the bearing from walking up into the gear area. But considering it's super low turning speeds, and never even a single entire revolution, I don't think anyone's ever had that issue. School's still out on which one I'm going to use.
While I don't have a face spanner of the correct size for the adjuster nut, I honestly have never used one. No need to get that tool now. Not for this. As luck would have it, I do happen to have the K-M tools for bearing drivers and the ball bearing "corn cob" tool to keep the balls in the rack. I got these after-the-fact from doing my last steering box many years ago and I'm figuring it'll make reassembly a bit easier. After watching Hutch's videos with his 1/2" hose trick (pretty ingenious), I'm thinking I can do the same thing with the "corn cob" tool without having to use grease and get by with the PS fluid.
Well, how about that.
Life is like a box of bearings. You never know what you're going to get.
GM sells it under p/n 5697804 for lotsa bucks. Current list price is $80.52 USD. It's an INA SLH12501 bearing made in USA.
I thought I bought an SKF USA-made bearing for the pitman shaft (to replace the ledged original) from Rockauto. It was a little over $6.50, around $12 total with shipping and tax. After opening the box today it seems I got an INA SLH12501 bearing in an SKF BH1250 box. Interesting. Note the "note" on the side of the box that says "Contains quality products manufactured or purchased by SKF." Pretty good feeling to know I got another GM bearing for chump change in comparison to paying through the nose for a GM box that just gets thrown away. I still have the full roller non-ledge, Timken USA bearing, but I think I'll likely go with this ledged one.
I gotta get my azz moving and yank out that steering box and get this show on the road.
Here's a pic of a GM bearing 5697804 showing it as an INA SLH12501 on a Brazil auction site.
Rockauto.com web page for the bearing. Cheap as I've ever seen it anywhere.
Life is like a box of bearings. You never know what you're going to get.
GM sells it under p/n 5697804 for lotsa bucks. Current list price is $80.52 USD. It's an INA SLH12501 bearing made in USA.
I thought I bought an SKF USA-made bearing for the pitman shaft (to replace the ledged original) from Rockauto. It was a little over $6.50, around $12 total with shipping and tax. After opening the box today it seems I got an INA SLH12501 bearing in an SKF BH1250 box. Interesting. Note the "note" on the side of the box that says "Contains quality products manufactured or purchased by SKF." Pretty good feeling to know I got another GM bearing for chump change in comparison to paying through the nose for a GM box that just gets thrown away. I still have the full roller non-ledge, Timken USA bearing, but I think I'll likely go with this ledged one.
I gotta get my azz moving and yank out that steering box and get this show on the road.
Here's a pic of a GM bearing 5697804 showing it as an INA SLH12501 on a Brazil auction site.
Rockauto.com web page for the bearing. Cheap as I've ever seen it anywhere.
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One of the most PITA procedures, IMO, is getting the 3 Teflon seals on the worm gear valve body installed. Dunking them in very warm to hot water helps make them pliable. The problem is that the seals expand and then wont shrink tight enough to get it in the housing. You could get the Kent Moore ring compression tool GM uses (more like a round funnel tool) to do the rack teflon ring, but any of them you find are nearly 100 bucks. Unless you do this a lot, it's not monetarily efficient.
(From oldsofb video series)
Found this procedure for dealing with teflon rings on a 4x4 website. I edited it to make it more complete and to add contextual information:
1. Make sure to locate the new o-rings and teflon seals. Cut off the 3 old seals/o-rings with a knife and discard them. Clean the valve body if not already.
2. Cut the top and bottom off a plastic drink bottle with a diameter larger than your valve body. Cut it about 4" high section (a bit longer than the teflon ring lands, you can be generous here) and then cut the side so you can adjust the diameter. Then, cut it to diameter by wrapping it semi-tight around the worm gear valve body and marking where it overlaps with a magic marker. Cut off the excess. Make sure there's no nicks/burrs on the edge that could catch and cut the teflon. It's self healing but no need to make more issues. The goal here is to make a plastic tube to wrap the rack to where the two edges of the plastic just meet up so the teflon rings can slide across all but the land you need it to go to. Don't worry, the teflon ring will compress the "tube" so you can slide the rings across.
3. Install all the new o-rings first. There's an o-ring for each land, and the teflon ring goes over that.
3. If you use the very warm to hot water dunking method to help relax the teflon seals, do this now. Then coat the plastic and the seals in steering fluid. From the worm gear side, wrap the plastic around the valve body just below the last seal groove toward the firewall, or top (groove closest to stub shaft splines). Work the first seal over the plastic and slide down until it hits that groove. Slide the plastic up to the next grove and repeat. Slide number 2 on and slide it down the plastic. Repeat with number 3. Should get them all on in less than a minute.
4. Now the real trick nobody tells you. The Teflon seals will be really stretched out. The trick is to wrap them in electrical tape. Wrap it around and then wrap the next wrap tighter and the next wrap tighter and the next even tighter. After 6 wraps or so it will have compressed the Teflon seals. Let it sit for a few hours, and then pull the tape off and the seals will be much much tighter and will now slide safety into the valve body. You can reduce that time significantly by taking appropriate sized hose clamps and tighten them over the tape on the rings. Typically, if you're meticulous, once you get the valve housing ready, you can set it off to the side and do other things to the box. The few hours of tape time may go pretty fast.
4A. There is a backup o-ring and teflon ring on the end of the rack piston, too. If you dip it in hot water to install it, and it gets too large, you can use the tape method to squeeze it back into shape in the step 4 above.
Do you HAVE to go through all this? No. You can try and get the rings on without the hot water, and I'm sure many have. It's just an option for you if you're worried about damaging the new teflon rings. Some people have more finesse than others. The teflon rings are pretty tough, and they are self-healing, but only to a degree.
Of course, anyone with any better ideas, or experiences, please chime in.
(From oldsofb video series)
Found this procedure for dealing with teflon rings on a 4x4 website. I edited it to make it more complete and to add contextual information:
1. Make sure to locate the new o-rings and teflon seals. Cut off the 3 old seals/o-rings with a knife and discard them. Clean the valve body if not already.
2. Cut the top and bottom off a plastic drink bottle with a diameter larger than your valve body. Cut it about 4" high section (a bit longer than the teflon ring lands, you can be generous here) and then cut the side so you can adjust the diameter. Then, cut it to diameter by wrapping it semi-tight around the worm gear valve body and marking where it overlaps with a magic marker. Cut off the excess. Make sure there's no nicks/burrs on the edge that could catch and cut the teflon. It's self healing but no need to make more issues. The goal here is to make a plastic tube to wrap the rack to where the two edges of the plastic just meet up so the teflon rings can slide across all but the land you need it to go to. Don't worry, the teflon ring will compress the "tube" so you can slide the rings across.
3. Install all the new o-rings first. There's an o-ring for each land, and the teflon ring goes over that.
3. If you use the very warm to hot water dunking method to help relax the teflon seals, do this now. Then coat the plastic and the seals in steering fluid. From the worm gear side, wrap the plastic around the valve body just below the last seal groove toward the firewall, or top (groove closest to stub shaft splines). Work the first seal over the plastic and slide down until it hits that groove. Slide the plastic up to the next grove and repeat. Slide number 2 on and slide it down the plastic. Repeat with number 3. Should get them all on in less than a minute.
4. Now the real trick nobody tells you. The Teflon seals will be really stretched out. The trick is to wrap them in electrical tape. Wrap it around and then wrap the next wrap tighter and the next wrap tighter and the next even tighter. After 6 wraps or so it will have compressed the Teflon seals. Let it sit for a few hours, and then pull the tape off and the seals will be much much tighter and will now slide safety into the valve body. You can reduce that time significantly by taking appropriate sized hose clamps and tighten them over the tape on the rings. Typically, if you're meticulous, once you get the valve housing ready, you can set it off to the side and do other things to the box. The few hours of tape time may go pretty fast.
4A. There is a backup o-ring and teflon ring on the end of the rack piston, too. If you dip it in hot water to install it, and it gets too large, you can use the tape method to squeeze it back into shape in the step 4 above.
Do you HAVE to go through all this? No. You can try and get the rings on without the hot water, and I'm sure many have. It's just an option for you if you're worried about damaging the new teflon rings. Some people have more finesse than others. The teflon rings are pretty tough, and they are self-healing, but only to a degree.
Of course, anyone with any better ideas, or experiences, please chime in.
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Made a seal parts diagram guide with a little info on it for the 800 series Saginaw box. I made this to ensure I got all the correct seals for the box from stem to stern. One thing I did learn by doing this is that EARLY Saginaw backing ring/Teflon Ring (you know, those three tough guys from the previous post?) kit, part number 5687182 does NOT include #6 and #9 (O-rings) on the diagram. Later GM kits do include these O-rings. Just something to consider when picking up GM parts if you're doing a complete seal replacement using GM/OEM parts. Most kits are still available today, believe it or not, but some may not be. I listed the bearing part numbers as well.
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