Column vs. Transmission Rooster Comb

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CaliWagon83

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Nov 12, 2017
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Trolling eBay for G-Body parts (my new unofficial hobby) I've found a lot of steering columns with column shifters for G-Bodies. None of them specified whether they were for the 3-speed or 4-speed transmissions.

Seems the main difference is in the "rooster comb" in the transmission itself. Is there any difference in the steering columns themselves between the THM200 and THM200-4R models? And the 4L60/65/70 is essentially an updated THM200-4R with electronic controls, right?
 
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Ribbedroof

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Jan 4, 2009
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Yes, columns have an internal gate for 3 OR 4 speed. I have a 4 speed (2004R) column in my wagon with a TH350 installed. it works OK, but the detents are not right

I suspect that using a 3 speed column shift gate in a 4 speed trans application may be how GM "locked out" Low in taxi/police/fleet applications
 

CaliWagon83

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Nov 12, 2017
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Other than not being able to manually select first gear, are there any disadvantages to running a 4-speed transmission with a 3-speed column?

If you get the column re-built, could you get a 4-speed detent installed, or would it be easier to just get a 4-speed factory column? Thanks.
 
Oct 14, 2008
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No, the 4L60-70E were an updated 700R4 trans. The shift pattern is very close to each on GM transmissions of that era, including the 4L80E. I used a 2004R in my 70 Cutlass and lined up fine. Getting the column shifter to line up on my 88 seems to be a challenge no matter a 3 or 4 speed trans. I have a 2004R back in it, was originally and park is off an reverse is right and barely touches drive. It was as close as I could get it to line up.
 

axisg

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Jul 17, 2007
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YYZ
I am not aware of any differences in the column. The shifter indicator plate on the dash of say a Monte is held in with 2 screws. 4 speed cars got an overlay to show the OD but that has nothing to do with the column.

As far as I know with the column cars the detents are all in the trans. For example if you remove the pin and disconnect the column from the shifter rod ( at the base of the column under the brake booster ) this should allow you to sit in the drivers seat, pull the column shfter towards you to get it out of park and it will fall with nothing in-between park and it's limit of travel.

In talking with another member he mentions the shifter rod ( which connects the column to the trans ) being different lengths and sightly different shape as well ( which I was never aware of ). This could be the ultimate difference that I have been chasing in my car ( which is a 3 to 4 speed swap and I struggle to barely catch 1st gear even with modified shifter and trans bracket )

Console cars is where it gets tricky. When swapping trans to or from 3 speed & 4speed without the related console shifter, cable and rod the detents tend to not line up and you either have to lock out 1st gear or have a hell of a time trying to line it up so it will set in park. I think everything between park and drive will line up with enough slop in the setup :)
 
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dickeymoore

G-Body Guru
May 6, 2009
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I know this is a old thread but did the different Rod make the difference of getting first gear in the 4-speed transmission with the 3-speed column?
 

69hurstolds

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Jan 2, 2006
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In my experience, there's no detents or any of that found in a column that you need to worry about. If the column is unlocked and you take the backdrive/shift linkage off the column, the column shift tube can be rotated at will to any position. You'll need to do that anyway if you take the column out of the car. I've never felt any detents in the column moving the lever to remove or install a column.

Don't know if the rod is the only difference, but AFAIK, there's NO such thing as a designated 3 speed column and 4 speed column. According to my "bibles" (parts books) they either have tilt, no tilt, console, no console, pulse wipers, no pulse wipers...etc. Additionally, the 4 speed 4R transmission backdrive rod for consoles is different on Olds than on other makes. So you can't get one from a Monte and it be the same as the Olds. Don't know the difference, but it's a different part number. All the attaching parts for the linkage like springs, bushings, etc. are the same, but the lever cross shaft and the rod from the column are different between 3 speed and 4 speed. I've only lived in the 4 speed world so never had a 3 speed one to compare the physical differences. The 4 speed rod is longer it seems, but other than that...

The shift tube (which has the arm on the end) is the same part number for the G-body tilt and a different number for the non-tilt. Doesn't matter whether it's column shift or console shift, it shows the same part number for each. Only difference in the parts are if it's tilt or not. So the arm at the bottom of the shift tube should be the same regardless of column or console shift.

EDITED TO ADD: I"m full of BS. There are shifter gates in a column shift car, but none on the console shift cars. I finally found some good info in the parts book. However, there's only two detents listed, either tilt or not. Nothing about transmission speeds. So the mystery continues I guess.
 
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dickeymoore

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May 6, 2009
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Yeah I was thinking that the rod for the 4-speed is just longer and maybe bent different to get the first gear so I'm wondering can I just use the 4 speed rod and hook to my 3-speed column and to the 700 R4 Transmission to get all the guilds from 1st to Park? THANKS
 

69hurstolds

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Jan 2, 2006
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If it fits and rotates, I'm betting it will. Not sure about the cross shaft (lever) part where the adjuster sleeve is as I stated, I don't know what the difference between them are. Always want to check for binding, just in case. Shouldn't even have to reset the backup switch position on top of the column.

Again, no such thing as a 3 or 4 speed column...
 

dickeymoore

G-Body Guru
May 6, 2009
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Yeah that sounds about right I'm just looking to track down the whole linkage from the column ,rod,the z-bar into the transmission thanks a lot of people say there's a rooster comb in the column you have to change
 
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