Have Electric Cars finally killed muscle cars???

[Hurricane77]

You've found the inverse of the EV requirements. The left is pushing EV's and the right's money people are stopping growable energy.

Perhaps that the inverse, but it's funny to watch the right argue against renewable energy and the left argue the exact opposite. As usual, sensible legislation lay in the middle ground somewhere, but neither side is willing to compromise.

There was actually a study recently published whose findings were that this idea of putting 10-15% Ethanol in our gas is actually worse in term of GHG emissions etc than just straight gasoline. Kinda of a win-win IMO Get the ethanol out of my gas and help the environment.

I've never been a big fan of ethanol for common use though, at least not as it's done in North America. Take agriculture land that could be used for food and using it to make fuel isn't a great idea in my opinion. One of the conclusions of the aforementioned study was that by mandated ethanol on gasoline, it actual caused a further in crease in the price of corn and related foods. Brazil does it better, they apparently use the by products of sugar cane processing. The stuff would have been tossed out anyway. And I think they get more ethanol per ton from the cane than we do from corn.

 

[Clone TIE Pilot]

Ummm.... this is already old news but.... it's not rocket surgery.

Monster Garage Builds Milwaukee V28 Li-Ion Powered Dragster | Toolmonger

Battery price is dropping substantially as time passes so this isn't going to be a game of the wealthy for long.

The price of batteries has declined by 97% in the last three decades

To transition towards low-carbon energy systems, we need low-cost energy storage. Battery costs have been falling quickly.

ourworldindata.org

Luckily ethanol and methanol are easy to make, so convert to E85 and not worry about fuel prices in 25 years.

There is also woodgas or swap in a military multifuel engine. Those engines can even run on filltered used motor oil laced with a little gas.

I don't know how good a cobbled together battery pack would be.EV battery packs require good liquid cooling systems. Even OEM battery packs can catch fire weeks after they are damaged. The fire issue combined with the toxic heavy metals sure will be a challenge for junkyards in the future.

The future of hotroding will likely move away from wenching on hardware and mostly will become hacking software. The bulk of hardware modifying will be replacing and rewiring the factory computer systems with more tunable aftermarket or homemade setups. Even that will likely run afoul with the law.

 

[Northernregal]

Depends on whether you look back at when this article was written in mid-2021, or believe the real lithium and carbonate price spikes as of recent time.

Gravity-defying lithium price rally continues with “little relief in sight”

Chinese lithium prices double again in 2022, Benchmark’s mid-March assessment shows with seasonal restart of domestic brine supply unlikely to counter growing deficits.

www.mining.com

The battery prices may come down, perhaps, but the lithium needed? The demand is already pushing prices up and up.

I was looking at the trend. 97% cost reduction in 20ish years. If we get to the $20/kwh range it'll be cheap enough for mostly us to play with. Technology is charging ahead because this is the hottest potential market in the world.

There is also woodgas or swap in a military multifuel engine. Those engines can even run on filltered used motor oil laced with a little gas.

I don't know how good a cobbled together battery pack would be.EV battery packs require good liquid cooling systems. Even OEM battery packs can catch fire weeks after they are damaged. The fire issue combined with the toxic heavy metals sure will be a challenge for junkyards in the future.

The future of hotroding will likely move away from wenching on hardware and mostly will become hacking software. The bulk of hardware modifying will be replacing and rewiring the factory computer systems with more tunable aftermarket or homemade setups. Even that will likely run afoul with the law.

I agree. Hacking and aftermarket controls will be the hotrodding of the future. Kinda like it is now with the ecu market controlling much more technically involved cars. It's going to be fun!

 

[motorheadmike]

Depends on whether you look back at when this article was written in mid-2021, or believe the real lithium and carbonate price spikes as of recent time.

Gravity-defying lithium price rally continues with “little relief in sight”

Chinese lithium prices double again in 2022, Benchmark’s mid-March assessment shows with seasonal restart of domestic brine supply unlikely to counter growing deficits.

www.mining.com

The battery prices may come down, perhaps, but the lithium needed? The demand is already pushing prices up and up.

Enron - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Hurricane77]

Enron - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Are you insinuating that mining companies could be cooking their books a la Enron?

Nah, that would never (cough Bre-X cough) happen.

 

[motorheadmike]

There was actually a study recently published whose findings were that this idea of putting 10-15% Ethanol in our gas is actually worse in term of GHG emissions etc than just straight gasoline. Kinda of a win-win IMO Get the ethanol out of my gas and help the environment.

I've never been a big fan of ethanol for common use though, at least not as it's done in North America. Take agriculture land that could be used for food and using it to make fuel isn't a great idea in my opinion. One of the conclusions of the aforementioned study was that by mandated ethanol on gasoline, it actual caused a further in crease in the price of corn and related foods. Brazil does it better, they apparently use the by products of sugar cane processing. The stuff would have been tossed out anyway. And I think they get more ethanol per ton from the cane than we do from corn.

 

[doood]

Ethanol isn't so bad - it serves the purpose of boosting octane rating today. Making it from corn isn't sustainable (hate to use that fashionable word), but wouldn't it be nice to eventually be able to split cellulose into the glucose that makes up the cellulose polymer (cellulase). That would kill electric vehicles a second time, eh?

This long article is the best writeup I've seen on leaded gas; it mentions ethanol as competing option for octane boosting back in the dawn of automobiles.

The Secret History of Lead

Research support was provided by the Investigative Fund of The Nation Institute. Follow-ups: "Amplification," June 19, 2000 and letters exchanges: "Lead--Balloons and Bouquets," May 15, and "Lead-Letter Office," July 3, 2000.

www.thenation.com

Side note; much of the tetraethyl lead additive was made by Dupont in my home town (ceased production in the '90s). Lead and swamp is what we got.

 

[Ernest]

Makes you wonder if this pre tesla EV craze was first started by this guy... he figured just about everything out himself, then took it to race tracks to show off its power and to get people interested and talking about it, impressive either way.

 

[Clone TIE Pilot]

Well here's another nail in the coffin.

I could see EVs bricking themselves until you have them serviced.

 

[doood]

Makes you wonder if this pre tesla EV craze was first started by this guy... he figured just about everything out himself, then took it to race tracks to show off its power and to get people interested and talking about it, impressive either way.

That guy in the Datsun lost control in a four way drag race on Netflix, where he crossed lanes and wrecked a one-of-a-kind turbo rotary Mazda RX2 (rare AF). Total California douchebag - tried to apologize after breaking the priceless Mazda.