Store with full tank or empty?
- Thread starter Bonnewagon
- Start date
That's another thing, the leftover 2 stroke fuel from my outboard motor. I never leave the dock without two 6 gallon fuel tanks. When one runs out, I switch to the other full tank. Then the empty comes home with me for a refill. At the end of the season I always have at least one full 6 gallon tank plus what's left in the other. Normally I can use that up with my 2 stroke snow blower. But we hardly get any snow anymore. Being TCW3 oil. it is ash-less, so when I just use it up in a lawn mower or car, it doesn't foul the spark plugs. I have dumped it into the Bonnewagon for over the winter. So far no issues at all.
My hat is off to you guys in cold country. We don’t have to do any of that in AZ. But we do get burned by hot steering wheels, ignition switches and seat belts in the summer.
2 stroke oil is an EXCELLENT upper lube that's cheeaap, and TCW3 is the best type to use if mixing into 4 stroke gas.
Related: https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/tc-w3-oil-add-to-fuel-in-vehicle.304864/
you forgot the "cold leather seats in the winter" and "hot vinyl seats in the summer"
Wait-whoa- people are putting TCW3 oil in the gas intentionally?!? I always said that was 'top end lube' line as a joke when anyone asked why I put my leftover outboard fuel into my car.
I mean any outboard since the early 60's uses a 50:1 mix. The last of the ETEC outboards had computerized oil injection and that was 100:1. These guys are using 640:1 or so?!? That is negligible. With 2 cycle oils, TCW3 is for water cooled engines like an outboard. It is ashless because you don't want to risk fouling plugs out on the water. Air cooled oil is different. It DOES make ash, and that is considered 'dry lube' for an air cooled engine. I have run lawn mowers, power washers, motorcycles, cars, everything, on leftover 50:1 TCW3 mix and never had a problem. But I would never claim a performance or mileage increase. Think about it. The only engine parts it would maybe see is the rings and intake valves. Maybe some gets to the stems. But it is going to get burned up. In an outboard motor the oil/gas mix is sprayed at the crankshaft as a mist. The oil gets deposited on the connecting rod roller bearings for lubrication. Some gets to the combustion chamber and burned up. If the 2 cycle oil gets deposited on the 4 cycle engine rings, I guess it could lubricate them helping against blow-by. I don't know.
Yeah, I don't know about mileage increases or polishing my piston tops but I've used it a few times over the last couple years, and my Cutlass has received it 3 times @ 1 oz per 3-4 gallons of gas. I didn't link the best thread on the topic but apparently quite a few people like using it, and I got turned onto it by an extremely money-conscious racer using it as upper lube. I thought he was full of BS but he swore by it, and I can see how it could also potentially be beneficial to fuel pumps, carb seals/ diaphragms, valve seats, etc.. I wonder if it might help protect things from formic acid? The only downside I noticed is the smell if you use a bit too much, and of course smoke if you go way overboard.
Guys claim it cleans the carbon off of stuff while simultaneously lubricating, which would make it a weak (and very cheap) version of fuel system cleaners containing PIB + lube. At just 97¢ a bottle it's an EXCELLENT addition to things like Toluene or lacquer thinner for a performance increase. *I'm not telling anyone that they should do it.* I won't run Toluene without an upper lube but I've used it throughout the years and even ran that mix in my '04 Sierra once as a test. It liked it, though that truck much prefers methanol, the main ingredient in Dollar General octane booster. A gallon of meth per full tank of 89 octane gas did wonders for a 4.8L. All of my engines like MMT but you can't run that every tank or you get buildup/deposits of manganese ash on plugs, exhaust valves, O2 sensors, and cats over time.
A bit of general info for the masses, I hope you don't mind the hijack... apologies if you do.
When looking at fuel system additives you'll see some acronyms that mean nothing, here's a key:
PEA- strong solvent, removes old deposits.
PIB- soft detergent, keeps things clean.
TEL- octane boost, lead substitute.*
MMT- octane boost, lead substitute. Mild power booster*
Toluene- octane boost, more powerful explosion.***
* Lead substitutes often have the added bonus of a mild performance increase in older vehicles designed for UN-leaded gas. MMT is a known power booster and pimped by STP and Lucas for that reason. Some substitutes also contain sodium and phosphorus- I have no idea how that affects things.
*** Alcohol is a solvent that washes away oil, decays rubber, and can be rough on plastic and fuel pumps in general. Using chemicals such as acetone, lacquer thinner, Toluene, Benzene, or Xylene can and WILL melt plastic fuel lines & parts and turn rubber ones rock hard. Requires use of PTFE lines, metal fuel pickup screen, brass floats, and Viton rubbers.
Fuel additives such as Stabil, Lucas, Heet, Sea Foam, and Marvel Mystery Oil are typically a blend of mineral oil, yellow oil, kerosene, alcohol, mineral spirits, denatured alcohol, naphtha/naphthalene, and even what's basically two stroke oil. These can be used to displace moisture, lube the top end, and clean deposits from both the fuel system as well as the oiling system.
For instance: two stroke oil works great as an upper lube according to all my research and although I can't verify it with definitive proof I still use it. I was taught that Kerosene was the same as Heet and have been using it for years, but have been informed otherwise by a knowledgeable forum member (69hurstolds). Alcohol works as an octane booster but wreaks havoc on carbs and other things due to attracting H2O and producing formic acid, which eats zinc and aluminum (old/ new carb bodies respectively). Naphtha a.k.a. charcoal lighter fluid works perfectly as injector cleaner, and I use that regularly too. Kingsford actually. We know a bit of transmission fluid in the oil will clean your engine internals, some use it in their gas as an upper lube and cleaner. I've never tried it but my grandfather did this.
Decades ago many engine builders would utilize Vaseline as assembly lube, it's still used to assemble transmissions, and can be used in place of Lucas oil stabilizer if you're in a pinch. Yup, being 100% petroleum it melts and mixes in never to drop out or solidify again. Marvel Mystery Oil is just mineral oil and mineral spirits.
Oh, and don't just go mixing stuff together- it can be dangerous to you and others. You can also run into phase separation as seen below.
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I have to disagree with one point Sweet_Johnny made: Kerosene is definitely NOT Heet. Not even close. The only things it has in common with Heet is that it's poisonous to humans and pets to inhale or ingest, and will burn if lit with a flame.
Heet comes in two forms. Yellow and Red bottles. Yellow is something like 99.999% methanol with a small amount of some sort of proprietary oil substance. Red is 98.5% isopropyl alchohol instead of the methanol. It's used as a method to reduce water in the fuel tank by the alcohol binding with that water, and as an anti-freeze for any fuel line freezing due to that water. Yellow was designed more for carbs and 4-stroke gas engines (don't use in diesels or 2-strokes), while red is touted as better for injected engines of all types, diesel, 2-stroke, etc, but it can be used in carbed engines as well.
SDS's for Heet-
Yellow
Red
SDS for Kerosene (typical)-
Kerosene is mainly paraffins and napthenes and hydrocarbons. It's petroleum-based. And because of that, kerosene WILL NOT MIX WITH WATER. Supposedly, the name Kerosene came from the Greek word "keros" meaning "wax". There was recently someone who was making kerosene from water and carbon-dioxide, but not sure what that deal is.
To prevent water from getting to your engine unimpeded and good to use as a gas anti-freeze, Heet is totally safe to use as directed. The methanol mixes with the water in the gas and suspends it as a fuel/alcohol/water emulsion, and will carry it to the carb and burn it in the engine by the regular process. Methanol is a pretty good cleaner itself, too, so it will do a little cleaning in the amount in a bottle, but not a lot. Because Heet wasn't designed primarily as a cleaner. If you want a very good cleaner for gums/varnish in your system, and help get rid of cylinder deposits as well, try BG 44K. A bit pricey, but very well worth it using it periodically, IMO. Sea Foam and Berryman B12 (just a stronger sea foam) aren't great for getting rid of water, so I wouldn't waste money on them using them for fuel treatments. Although, the early metal cans (yes, metal cans) of Heet says you can free sticky valves and carbon deposits by pouring down the carb while running the engine fast until it chokes out, then let it sit for about 1/2 hour and then crank it up as usual. Sound familiar? Funny, it doesn't recommend doing that anymore on the plastic bottles.
No matter what you do, all the cleaners and anti-freeze products in a can are not substitutes from using good, quality fuel and doing proper tunes and maintenance. There's no such thing as a "Savior In A Can". Although, some of the products can help out when used as intended. Heet is a quality product that works for its intended purpose. If it were damaging components and killing engines, they'd have gone out of business eons ago. Heet's been around for what, 60 plus years? I don't think I'd run it all the time. I only use it about 2 or 3 times a year, if that, on the cars that get the most running time.
Just a further word about the Iso-Heet, the red stuff. You can buy the 11 ounce bottle for 3-4 bucks, or you can go to the drug store and spend the same amount of money for a 32 oz. bottle of 91% Isopropyl alcohol. It will do the same thing to the water in your tank. So, your call. Basically 3 "treatments" or 1? Hmm.
Heet comes in two forms. Yellow and Red bottles. Yellow is something like 99.999% methanol with a small amount of some sort of proprietary oil substance. Red is 98.5% isopropyl alchohol instead of the methanol. It's used as a method to reduce water in the fuel tank by the alcohol binding with that water, and as an anti-freeze for any fuel line freezing due to that water. Yellow was designed more for carbs and 4-stroke gas engines (don't use in diesels or 2-strokes), while red is touted as better for injected engines of all types, diesel, 2-stroke, etc, but it can be used in carbed engines as well.
SDS's for Heet-
Yellow
Red
SDS for Kerosene (typical)-
Kerosene is mainly paraffins and napthenes and hydrocarbons. It's petroleum-based. And because of that, kerosene WILL NOT MIX WITH WATER. Supposedly, the name Kerosene came from the Greek word "keros" meaning "wax". There was recently someone who was making kerosene from water and carbon-dioxide, but not sure what that deal is.
To prevent water from getting to your engine unimpeded and good to use as a gas anti-freeze, Heet is totally safe to use as directed. The methanol mixes with the water in the gas and suspends it as a fuel/alcohol/water emulsion, and will carry it to the carb and burn it in the engine by the regular process. Methanol is a pretty good cleaner itself, too, so it will do a little cleaning in the amount in a bottle, but not a lot. Because Heet wasn't designed primarily as a cleaner. If you want a very good cleaner for gums/varnish in your system, and help get rid of cylinder deposits as well, try BG 44K. A bit pricey, but very well worth it using it periodically, IMO. Sea Foam and Berryman B12 (just a stronger sea foam) aren't great for getting rid of water, so I wouldn't waste money on them using them for fuel treatments. Although, the early metal cans (yes, metal cans) of Heet says you can free sticky valves and carbon deposits by pouring down the carb while running the engine fast until it chokes out, then let it sit for about 1/2 hour and then crank it up as usual. Sound familiar? Funny, it doesn't recommend doing that anymore on the plastic bottles.
No matter what you do, all the cleaners and anti-freeze products in a can are not substitutes from using good, quality fuel and doing proper tunes and maintenance. There's no such thing as a "Savior In A Can". Although, some of the products can help out when used as intended. Heet is a quality product that works for its intended purpose. If it were damaging components and killing engines, they'd have gone out of business eons ago. Heet's been around for what, 60 plus years? I don't think I'd run it all the time. I only use it about 2 or 3 times a year, if that, on the cars that get the most running time.
Just a further word about the Iso-Heet, the red stuff. You can buy the 11 ounce bottle for 3-4 bucks, or you can go to the drug store and spend the same amount of money for a 32 oz. bottle of 91% Isopropyl alcohol. It will do the same thing to the water in your tank. So, your call. Basically 3 "treatments" or 1? Hmm.
It seems that you've caught me spreading misinformation- thank you for stopping that. I'll change the post.
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