Terrorist eco-weenies strike again... goodbye decent oil for old engines....

[Clone TIE Pilot]

It seems like a 'oil additive technology has changed and we are updating our labeling to align and allow us more flexibility to adjust trace elements based on availability and cost' than the manufacturers actually changing the hard oil base ingredients.

I once sat next to a senior chemist from Exxon-Mobile at a conference over a beer and I asked him about synthetic oils and he asked if I am talking about SYNTHETIC or Synthetic,

Synthetic is not SYNTHETIC

SYNTHETIC oil is the base oil/slippy stuff that does add some leakage if your seals are shot or old
Synthetic is what you get when you buy 'synthetic blend' and is just the sub trace elements that are put in




Besides, I have come to a different viewpoint on the whole 'ethanol and synthetic oil are causing all these problems' train.

Yes, if you put e85 in a 40 year old, un-serviced fuel system it's going to show you where all the things are worn out. Same as putting synthetic in your 40 year old SBC. The seals are shot and dried out. The ethanol/syn oil didn't cause your seals to fail, it just exposed that they were shot.

If syn oil was causing all these leaks, why is the bottom of 75% of old cars covered in oil/grease/muck after 2 years on the road and never had syn oil installed but 10 year old cars built recently don't? It's not because the syn oil caused the leaks, it's because rope main rear seals and cork gaskets sucked. My FIL's 64 mustang got OE quality gaskets on a rebuild and leaked like a sieve until it got re-gasketed with steel core, molded silicone modern improved gaskets.

It's like if you have a worn out tire that is out of balance at 78 mph. If you drive 75 or under all the time you never notice the out of balance. When you go 80 and it starts shaking it's not like the tire decided to fail at 78, you have just never put it in a condition that causes it to exhibit the out of balance. That doesn't mean that the tire was ever not out of balance.

Also dirt builds up around old seals and create a false seal which synthetic can wash away and expose a faulty seal. Seals will last longer if they have been ran with synthetic their whole service lives. Good for newer stuff but bad for older stuff that ran on conventional oil for years. Overall, the auto industry doesn't give a flip over old stuff, they rather you junk it and buy new with lots of loans.

 

[ck80]

Yes, if you put e85 in a 40 year old, un-serviced fuel system it's going to show you where all the things are worn out. Same as putting synthetic in your 40 year old SBC. The seals are shot and dried out. The ethanol/syn oil didn't cause your seals to fail, it just exposed that they were shot.

And see, that's the old splitting hairs argument. Unlike ethanol, I doubt synthetic is eating the gasket or seal away in a traditional sense.

but I DO believe synthetics with their associated additives can erode a deposit and allow a gasket or seal to fail that otherwise wouldn't. Kind of like cutting away a bank and some trees behind an old dam. It didn't make the dam fail, but, it'd have lasted but for cutting the bank.

it's because rope main rear seals and cork gaskets sucked. My FIL's 64 mustang got OE quality gaskets on a rebuild and leaked like a sieve until it got re-gasketed with steel core, molded silicone modern improved gaskets.

Again, true...

BUT, not everyone has the luxury of time, money, space, tools, or ability to just leisurely rip out an engine and re gasket it with modern materials, just to become compatible with a different oil being forced upon them. As you say, original style gaskets, even brand new, in a quality rebuild, aren't meant for that synthetic stuff..

Also dirt builds up around old seals and create a false seal which synthetic can wash away and expose a faulty seal. Seals will last longer if they have been ran with synthetic their whole service lives. Good for newer stuff but bad for older stuff that ran on conventional oil for years. Overall, the auto industry doesn't give a flip over old stuff, they rather you junk it and buy new with lots of loans.

All true.

And problem is, they're forcing it on you, no just putting the products side by side and allowing choice.

Just because the underlying issue had the POTENTIAL to leak doesn't mean it ever actually WOULD leak, absent forcing the synthetic oil into the mix. The common denominator is that there's no leaks without the synthetic, and leaks with it.

 

[SRD art]

Personally I always feel torn on these issues. If we didn't have progression we'd still be riding real horses and using candles. But on the other hand I don't particularly like someone else making that decision for me. For example putting a year/date when fossil fuels go away instead of just letting that take it's natural course feels like someone's taking away my freedom to choose. I'm sure as things get less and less geared towards old cars companies that support what we do like Royal Purple for example will step up. Only bad thing is there may come a point when a lot of motorheads will start weighing they can afford to maintain their hobby or just leave it to those that have money and keep their cars in the garage most of the time. 🤔🙁

 

[Rgpmalibu]

And people say lawyers don't give us anything good....

Never saw this at Men's Wearhouse...

 

[Supercharged111]

As was stated, unless you're pouring in Amsoil or Redline, you're just getting highly refined dino oil. I switched my 1500 in sig over to Mobil1 in 2009 and guess what happened? No new leaks! But I went from a 3000 mile interval to a 5000 mile interval and cost per mile was about the same. Once dad's Monte has a roller cam I'll stop feeding it dino oil too. It has Rotella in it now.

 

[Texas82GP]

If you haven't been to the stores lately, something has been happening since early summer...

Conventional, true conventional, motor oils are as gone as the dinosaurs from which they were made.

If you're lucky enough to find something mis-labeled "conventional" you will see it now has a "SP" rating on the jug... meaning it's actually a syn-blend at best. Which, you probably will also find in fine print somewhere on jug or in data sheets.

If you noticed more drips in the driveway then you're probably right.

So, prepare to be pulling motors and spending LOTS of money and time chasing oil leaks that spring from your forced conversion to the crap that has greater propensity to seep and weep through tiny spaces than good old Dino oil did/does.

Yes, the spaces the oil leaks through were already there. But the old stuff didn't make it through them.

"Progress"... <sigh>

I prefer to buy most of my oil change supplies online and stock up. I've been running the Amazon conventional 5w30 oil in my truck, for 5000 mile change intervals (roughly 4 months) with good results. I found lots of 10w30 conventional, 5 quart jugs online (Castrol, Napa, etc.).

 

[Gwarren79]

Dino oil can be had for 1.80 a quart or less in 5 or 6 gallon containers...

 

[olds307 and 403]

Looks at cabinet full of synthetic oils with lots of Gucci additives...

[Shrugs]

Guess y'all need LS swaps now?

I would rather my 70 wear a diaper. Maybe a Gucci one🤔

 

[olds307 and 403]

We still sell conventional oil, made at our own refinery in Regina. Pretty it isn't disappearing.

 

[motorheadmike]

I would rather my 70 wear a diaper. Maybe a Gucci one🤔