200-4r rebuild advice

[alphamale]

I have a 200-4r I'm looking to rebuild soon and was looking for some feedback. It is a KTF code trans which according to the interwebs came out of an olds 88 most likely. I would like to know if it is worth hunting down a CZF BRF trans or would building up this one with upgraded parts be just as good? I have tried contacting CK Performance by phone and email with no response. Not sure if they are no longer in business, but they have a website up still. If anyone has gone through this before and could help me out I would appreciate it.

The end goal is an overdrive trans that can handle up to 400-450 lb/ft of torque. I have a Buick 350 in my cutlass now, but have a 70' olds 455 waiting to be built and installed in the next year or two.

 

[V8 Rumble]

This is my build. I think it is well worth it.
I've contacted ck around 3pm est and had better luck.

You can also contact dave husek.he's another 200-4r guru he was very very helpful when I built mine and I went to his shop to get some parts to. His number is 516-285-1103.

Texast on here was extremely helpful to as he also build his own 200-4R

This is my build thread

https://gbodyforum.com/threads/200-4r-build-its-starting-complete.57646/

 

[alphamale]

That helps out a lot thank you. Is the valve body the main difference between the CZF BRF and other trans codes? Is it better to get a valve body like those or does it make a huge difference. Are there other differences mechanically that would benefit from a GN MCSS 442 type trans? The reason I ask is I have already purchased an 87KTF trans and I have never gotten a solid answer on other sites as to what exactly makes these codes different other than a higher shift point and upgraded parts in the later models. As long as I can build what I have to withstand occasional abuse behind a BBO and in front of a 3.73 posi with street tires then I will be happy. I will definitely be referencing your build and contacting Texast for questions. I won't be back in the states for another 3 months so I have time to sort these things out.

 

[V8 Rumble]

The czf is good for the v8 cars due to shifts and calibrated to where the car makes power turbo vs BRF N/A. This is a big difference between the brf and czf. The ktf valve body as with others will most likely be calibrated to your use anyhow.

Your servo is also smaller compared to the czf,kzf,brf trans. The governor is also not calibrated for performance either so it will also need to be modified or replaced with one from the performance 200-4Rs.

 

[alphamale]

Thanks for the info, I'll give CK another call and see if they answer. Also, I noticed you went with Transgo reprogramming kit instead of one of CK's rebuild kits. Is there a reason you went that route over the other? Just curious, I've read up on other builds, it seems about 50/50 one way or the other. I appreciate the part links up front as well in your write up. Have you installed the trans since the rebuild and have you driven on it at all? Thanks again.

 

[V8 Rumble]

The transgo was a gift.plus for the 150 price with the servo it was a good price.

I will be getting the tc soon. I have the trans on my bench currently.

If you have any questions feel free to ask. I'm not a pro but whatever I can help with I'll try.

 

[64nailhead]

Sun gear, shell, pump, servo, clutches. Those are my recommendations. Getting a quality machined valve body is also important. The 'performance' 200's run a better pump, servo and performance based governors. Keep in mind that governors are easily changed once the pan is removed by most anyone. Finding one at a junkyard andswapping it in yourself is less than than a 2 hour job.

Getting a hold of Chris at CK is sometimes demanding, but his transmissions are excellent!

Persoanlly, as long as you aren't running sticky tires, an upgraded pump, servo and clutches are the bare necessities. We are running about 600 crank HP through ours and it hasn't broken yet - lol. We are running a CK Street/Strip that we upgraded the sun gear, input shaft and drum after we bought it. Seems to work flawlessly with no issues- so far. We do need a new TC though.

 

[alphamale]

I'm pretty new to trans rebuilds. When you say ""getting a quality machined valve body is important" do you mean an aftermarket one or getting mine machined by a professional? I have seen that TCI and some others make a replacement VB and considered that route. Although I have read that they try to compensate for he TV cable by essentially running high pressure constantly which can stress the pump.

Also, do they make upgraded aftermarket governors? I think if I were able to find one in a junk yard off a performance trans that I would just pull the whole trans and start from there. I was under the impression that most of these trans have already been picked clean from the yards over the years.

I have no experience on these transmissions so the terminology I guess is what is confusing to me.

 

[64nailhead]

Regarding the governor, it works much like a distributor in regards to changing mechanical advance springs. It spins and opens up at different rpm's. The preferred ones are from the 442, Monte SS and GN trans '86, '87 and maybe '85. To look at a stock grocery getting one vs a performance one you will be able to see the obvious differences. But when push comes to shove, you can manually shift from 1st to second if needed. And this part is very easily replaced and/or tuned after the trans is assembled and installed. And you can buy a performance one from many vendors such as PATC, Bowtie OD's, etc. or you can try modifying a stock one to shift where you want it to.

Regarding line pressure, the TV cable setting and the pump. The pump makes 'x' amount of pressure and the TV cable adjustment directs the line pressure to the necessary parts of the trans or into bypass. The pump requires a certain amount of pressure and fluid to operate. You do not adjust the pump's pressure with the TV cable, but rather adjust the line pressure with the TV. Most stock pumps are 4 vane and cannot handle high power builds. A rebuilt 7 or 10 vane pump is what is needed for any type of mild or performance build. They are not that expensive IMO.

Building this trans yourself as a performance build for your first transmission rebuild is not recommended by me. Tuning it (governor) and setting the line pressure correctly is relatively easy and straight forward. Building this yourself to handle 400ft/lbs is going to require $1500-$1800 in parts and considering that you can buy one at this power level for $2-2500 I believe you'd be farther ahead to buy one and have the vendor's warranty. Perhaps you are a detailed oriented guy that is either willing to purchase the correct tools or already has the correct tools, and you have the patience and are willing to spend the time reading. If this is the case, then go for it. Building this trans for the first timer is not a weekend project. You know what your skill level is, make a decision from there.

If you build is mild, 300HP/350TQ, then a stock unit with an upgraded pump, servo and governor will work just fine. And at that point a stock rebuild kit with upgraded clutches and bands is all that is needed. But as the power increases, so does the number of components that need to be upgraded; just like every other part of the car.

Good luck - Jim

 

[L92 OLDS]

Also, do they make upgraded aftermarket governors? I think if I were able to find one in a junk yard off a performance trans that I would just pull the whole trans and start from there. I was under the impression that most of these trans have already been picked clean from the yards over the years.

I have no experience on these transmissions so the terminology I guess is what is confusing to me.

Among the performance 2004R transmissions, the CZF code calibration (Monte Carlo SS) has the highest shift points and unless you own a turbo Buick they are the most sought after for rebuilds. If you build one yourself, this would be the way to go. Keep in mind that the 86' and up cores have better internals and updates. With the help of an experienced transmission guy, I rebuilt an OZ code (Hurst Olds) and looking back would have paid an experienced 2004R shop instead. If you use a good vendor like CK or Extreme Automatics they can modify a standard fare granny valve body and governor to your shift preferences. They have cores or you can provide one. Depending on your location shipping it to them may not make sense. The 2004R is a finicky trans can be a challenge to get right even for guys with years of experience.