383 in My Cutty

[beermonkey9417]

Here's some good books to read that will really help clear up a lot of questions. Not that I mind helping, it's just the more you understand youself, the better you'll know what you want and how to get it.

These cae found at amazon.com or if you have a Barnes & Noble. You may even find some to check out a bigger local library.

Here's the first one I'd recommend getting (RIP John Lingenfelter...): http://www.amazon.com/John-Lingenfelter ... 406&sr=1-1

and then anything written by David Vizard. Here's just a random sampling of good reads:

http://www.amazon.com/How-Rebuild-Your- ... 504&sr=1-1
http://www.amazon.com/Build-Small-Block ... 504&sr=1-2
http://www.amazon.com/Rebuild-Small-Blo ... 504&sr=1-3
http://www.amazon.com/Small-Block-Chevy ... 04&sr=1-12
http://www.amazon.com/Build-Performance ... 240&sr=1-5

its funny, i have like half of them books! they do help, ALOT!

 

[jonnyv713]

I've enjoyed reading this post. I'm remember being at the exact same point where your at with your car except I was 14 at the time. I'm 19 now (just wait till these older guys jump in :wink: ) and this site will definately help you out in the long run. On top of my old man teaching me for years now, you will learn things on your own and figure out different ways of going about certain aspects of the car. I daily drove my malibu for 5-6 years before the driveshaft snapped (dont ask me how).

As for the engine, if your building this car to handle primarily on the street, then keep your torque numbers in mind. The rpm air gap intake will help you with that. Do not go with a single plane intake as that is meant for the high rpms and drag racing, which you will never see. Remember the cardinal rule "bigger is not always better". There was a point where I wanted to put the biggest cam, port/polish the heads, and be the fastest car on the road. Then as you drive around for a while, you realize that there are gonna be cars faster than you. My rule is whenever I build a motor, I use forged internals as a safety precaution and to avoid the possibility of an internal cast part failing. I run flat top hyper pistons in my 350 and haven't had one problem with them.

I know your figure of speech when it comes to the mustangs as I've seen every variation of the damn things, including those with cowl hoods, and am tired of their bark. But the simple thing you need to realize is that those mustangs are a dime a dozen and your car is not. Those guys can easily go to a used car lot and find another one. That's why I stopped kickin every import and tuners a** that I came across because it is not worth it, especially after you invest 6 years worth of time, money, and labor.

Somebody taught you well and you did some good listening! BTW...is 50 years old, old enough?

Yeah, I used to have a 69 Camaro that had a nice lopey cam...it sounded real mean. After many years you start to learn...and I did too. Sounding mean don't get it done in a street car. Torque does! You feel torque. Horsepower is just a mathmatical measurement and an engine is considered a horsepower motor when the powerband is in the higher rpm ranges. All engines make more hp over 5252 rpm due to the formula used to compute horsepower. Optimize your power range for 7000 rpm and you have a horsepower motor. Optimize it for power in the 4000 - 4500 rpm range and you have a torque motor (torque MONSTER!). Does your street motor live in these rpm ranges? Not generally.

Keep your duration in the 220 - 230 range with a lobe seperation of 110 - 112 and it'll make good torque. You can also use streetable gear to keep your engine in that powerband. Push the duration into the 240 - 250 range with a 106 - 110 seperation and it will lope like hell! It will also be a flat out dog on the street unless you run 4.56 gears to keep it in that rpm range. And don't fool yourself into thinking you can run 4.56's unless you have an overdrive transmission. If you don't, don't plan on leaving town or stray too far from your local gas station. 5000 rpm at 60 mph isn't *streetable*.

I'm not saying a torque motor doesn't have a lope to it...just a lot less due to smaller duration and less overlap on the cam. It makes guys with that bad-*ss sounding cam wonder how you just blew their doors off with such a *stock* car...

One word...Torque!

You feel torque...you measure horsepower.

So, basically the roller cam that I picked out is about perfect for the street. It has 224/230 duration and 110 separation. And the operating range is 1900 to 5600. Will it still make it sound cool. cause man do i like that lopey sound, but i am mainly goig for performance. Also, I will be building my 200-4R to handle the power. With the overdrive and that cam what would the perfect gears be in there.

Oh, with the cam operating in such a low RPM range, will i be able to run a good time at the track still?

 

[86Cutlass383SR]

JohnnyV I don't think you could've picked a much better cam ... you did good!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FhynMKi7mU

This is fairly close to what it should sound like. You'll have a 383 vs his 355 but you'll have 2* more lobe seperation too. It'll be close to this one.

With a 200-4R you could go 3.23 - 3.42 and have all the torque you need for launch and good highway cruise, too.

And yes, it'll be a mid to low 12 car with that cam. For a true daily driven street car, that ain't bad...

As for gears in a torque engine, you actually want the engine pulling. And since it's making so much power in the 2000 - 6000 rpm range, you don't need gears in the 3.73 - 4.11 range. Unless you have some huge meats in the back, you'll just be doing a smoke show anyway.

The reason the high horsepower cars need those gears is to keep the engine in the 4000 - 7000 rpm range the motor makes power at.

Gear for your power range.

 

[86Cutlass383SR]

Here's the one I picked for my 383. It's one step bigger than yours but it's also on a wider lobe seperation. Comp XFI280 hyd roller.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhY4bgyuMig
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IBL9cuJvsg

I'm getting so freaking close to having mine in the car...

 

[patmckinneyracing]

I would like to run a roller cam, but I'm running a gen 1 350 that is setup for hydraulic flat tappet cams. To go with a full hydraulic roller kit with lifters, rockers, cam, and all the other parts is too expensive for me at this point.

 

[jonnyv713]

Would that one that you have be better than the one I seen?

 

[86Cutlass383SR]

I don't really think it'd be any better or not. It's always better to choose a bit too small than too big. After I get mine running I *may*, at a later time, even swap down to a custom 224/230 113 hyd roller. A lot of guys on thirdgen.org was using this cam with the same SuperRam intake that I'm also using so I thought I'd try it. May end up dropping down to the same basic cam you was looking at anyway.

I'm using the retro-fit lifters and cam, too. I'd keep your eyes peeled for a used set of lifters. Get a new cam for $260 from summit and then order new pushrods. It differance between a hydraulic flat tappet cam and a hydraulic roller is amazing...especially if you have the heads to support the power. Used hyd roller lifters can be reused unlike the flat tappet lifters.

 

[patmckinneyracing]

Nevermind i got what he was asking. While were on the roller topic, what is the cheapest way to going about setting up a gen 1 350 block from flat tappet to roller?

 

[86Cutlass383SR]

The biggest hurdle is the lifters. New they are close to $500. That's why I suggested looking for used. A new cam is about $260 from Summit for a Comp Cams grind. The pushrods are shorter due to the roller lifters. Then you need some type of bushing between the cam and the timing cover.

I'm using a roller cam button but there are also nylon ones. The pushrods won't be much more expensive if any. The roller lifters can be reused if you swap to a differant cam. The Comp Cams hyd rollers have a stock type cam gear on back so you can run a regular distributor gear. They *recommend* a composite gear but I ran a stock gear for a couple years before they invented one. Since they never changed the cam gear on the cam, why switch now... :?

 

[jonnyv713]

The lifters I need come in the kit, right?