Holy sh*t is all i can say! how have i missed this thread? just went trough the whole thing and damn im impressed. mad skills and lots of awesome ideas! keep it up ill be following this thread for sure.
BUILD THREAD “The Juggernaut”
- Thread starter Rktpwrd
- Start date
Thanks RatRod
I've taken a bit of a hiatus from working on the 'Naut over the summer months as I've picked up another Cutlass that's pretty clean but needs a bit of attention.
There's still a bunch of work I've done to the Juggernaut but haven't yet updated on the build thread. I need to and will update the thread with the work done, but just need to find/make the time. It'll happen fairly soon, I promise!
🙂
Thanks so much for the positive comments
Donovan
Me being a welder myself... just wanted to say DAMN good job on the frame and modding the exhaust thru the floor and out the side. #inspiring
Alright Guys (and Gals!), I've been threatening to post up some updates on the car for a while now, so here we finally go.
First of all, I've gotta say, wow. It really has been quite a while since I've posted any new info on the car. I actually had to backtrack several pages to remind myself where the heck I left off! Not good. Anyways, the last I left off, I was starting to cover the sheetmetal modifications I'd done. I covered aligning panels and welding/filing to achieve better panel gaps, the little curvature modification to the lower fenders to the rocker panels, filling the marker light holes, and shaving the door handles and locks. All these were pretty minor mods compared to what I'm about to delve into next...
At one point earlier in the thread, I mentioned a spoiler alert and gave you a sneak peek into the idea (and what inspired it) of what to do with the rear firewall area between the passenger compartment and the trunk since I decided the car was only going to be a two seater with no back seat whatsoever. (This was around page 13 if I recall correctly). In the interest of refreshing everyone's memory (including mine), and save the skipping back and forth between pages to see what the hell I'm talking about, I'm going to post them up here again, but this time with more info and more in depth. This also leads directly into the further sheetmetal mods that were necessary to support it. So follow along...
After deciding to eliminate the rear seat, something was needed in the way of a rear firewall to block out road noise and potential fumes that could come from the trunk area. Taking inspiration from the area known as "The Waterfall" on Corvettes, an Olds inspired shape was conceived from an old F85 emblem.
From this small image taken from the internet, a much larger one dimensional shape based on the interior dimensions was cut out of sheetmetal. From there, blue masking tape lines were laid out in the areas that would be bent to give the image a three dimensional form.
These bends were made at roughly 45 degrees, the tape was removed, and the piece was test fit again to see if it was along the lines of what I wanted. It was.
Small holes were punched in the flanges I had purposely created for plug welding to the two side filler panels it was next to get. The rough cut versions of these were similarly mocked up. Note the notches for the wheelwells hadn't even been made as of yet in this pic.
After a little trimming and refining...
...they were a little closer to the final shape but still had a ways to go.
The blue masking tape strips had outlined where the center depression needed to be to match the emblem. It was removed, 'cause it was time to add this detail next. Unable to stamp and stretch the needed shape into the metal, the exact centerline was found, then a cut was made directly down it. The desired depth was decided upon, and marked out as a flange on each side of the cut. From there, the two flanges were created by bending on the lines that determined the depth. This gave me the width and the depth of the center feature, but not the back. The back portion was created by bending up a simple 5 sided box that fit exactly around the outside of the two inner flanges on the main piece. The box portion was then welded to the backside of the main piece. Confused yet? It turned out like this:
From there, the whole assembly was once more test fit inside the car, but this time with more attention and bead rolled features added to the side filler panels.
If you look closely, in some of the pics, you can see that a 90 degree bend was made at the top, with the thought being that it would cover up the sheetmetal portion of the rear package tray (and its many holes) and give me an area to weld the top of the assembly in to as well. This was one of those "sounds good in theory" ideas, but was soon to change.
It's at this point that I need to stop and change gears here slightly. There was more than just the desire to eliminate the rear seat that drove this particular modification. Remember waaay back to when I covered the plumbing of the air and brake lines on the car? I had chosen to mount them partially on the front side of the rear frame crossmember, and when it came time to test fit the body on the car, everything cleared ok, but it had left me with no room to access any of the fasteners that held the tubing in place, never mind being able to get a tool in there!
So how this pertains to the rear firewall, when the firewall was created, it was moved ahead roughly 4 !/2" at the floor, and around 3" at the top package tray area resulting in the nice "slant" to it you see in the pics. This purposely also reduced the size of the "dead" area between the front seat backs and the rear firewall. Voila, 2 birds with one stone.🙂
Ok, phew! Now, anyone that's been fooling with cars for a while, knows that making modifications to anything the factory created is much like pulling a loose thread on a sock. This is what I've come to call my "Sock Thread Theory".
Lol
It goes something like this:
You think that pulling on that loose thread at the cuff of your sock is going to just affect the others directly around it before it breaks. However, more often than not, it will cause completely different threads to bunch up somewhere completely unexpected. Like waaay down there at the toe. That's because all the threads in the sock are all intertwined with each other, and pulling one affects ALL others around it.
The same principle applies to making modifications to cars. One modification here affects several other things you didn't immediately think about over there. This particular modification of mine is a prime example of this phenomenon.
Mounting tubing to the crossmember affected access to the fasteners. Moving the rear firewall forward to counter this then affected the distance it sat from the trunk floor, creating a gap.
And so it goes...
Oh, And btw, before I get swamped with "well why didn't you just move and bend up more tubing..." comments, I had spent roughly $400 in bulk stainless steel tubing in various sizes, roughly around another $150-200 dollars in misc fittings and about 3 solid months of my time creating all the various special bends and making it all look as perfect as I could, so I wasn't about to turn my back on all that and start over again. That was a non-negotiable point for me.
So, on to the trunk floor.
Now that I had a sizeable gap inbetween the newly created rear firewall and the existing kick-up portion of the trunk floor, it was time to assess this area next before the rear firewall could be finished. The area of the trunk floor in question was a nightmare of a piece to try and reproduce even with all my metal shaping tools and newfound experience at the ready, so I got to scrutinizing the whole area and developed a game plan.
The decision was made to fabricate and replace the entire kicked-up section of the trunk floor. Now, before you go and think I've gone completely off my rocker, hear me out. There were several factors that lead to this decision.
1) I now had an ugly gap to fill between the rear firewall and the existing trunk floor.
2) My Cutlass has the body cushions in the area above the rear crossmember, and the sheetmetal mounts that sit on them supporting the body were starting to rust out. Easiest way to repair/replace them was with the trunk floor removed.
3) You may recall I added QA1 anti-lift bars to the rear suspension. These mount between the upper cast-in ears of the differential and raise the actual mounting point of the upper control arms. While these are a worthy upgrade to change the car's instant center and apply more leverage on the tire increasing traction, they were never designed to be used on an air ride equipped vehicle. I found that they had the negative effect of causing the upper control arms to just touch the underside of the trunk floor kick-up when it was aired down. Rather than not use them, I decided instead to RAISE the trunk floor with an additional bit extra in case the arms got longer if I needed to adjust their length.
So, the most logical spot to separate the kicked-up section of the trunk floor from the rest of the trunk floor was found at a factory spot welded seam in the transition area between the two. The spot welds were drilled out along here, and in the areas where it attached to the inner wheelwells. Here the section has been removed.
First of all, I've gotta say, wow. It really has been quite a while since I've posted any new info on the car. I actually had to backtrack several pages to remind myself where the heck I left off! Not good. Anyways, the last I left off, I was starting to cover the sheetmetal modifications I'd done. I covered aligning panels and welding/filing to achieve better panel gaps, the little curvature modification to the lower fenders to the rocker panels, filling the marker light holes, and shaving the door handles and locks. All these were pretty minor mods compared to what I'm about to delve into next...
At one point earlier in the thread, I mentioned a spoiler alert and gave you a sneak peek into the idea (and what inspired it) of what to do with the rear firewall area between the passenger compartment and the trunk since I decided the car was only going to be a two seater with no back seat whatsoever. (This was around page 13 if I recall correctly). In the interest of refreshing everyone's memory (including mine), and save the skipping back and forth between pages to see what the hell I'm talking about, I'm going to post them up here again, but this time with more info and more in depth. This also leads directly into the further sheetmetal mods that were necessary to support it. So follow along...
After deciding to eliminate the rear seat, something was needed in the way of a rear firewall to block out road noise and potential fumes that could come from the trunk area. Taking inspiration from the area known as "The Waterfall" on Corvettes, an Olds inspired shape was conceived from an old F85 emblem.
From this small image taken from the internet, a much larger one dimensional shape based on the interior dimensions was cut out of sheetmetal. From there, blue masking tape lines were laid out in the areas that would be bent to give the image a three dimensional form.
These bends were made at roughly 45 degrees, the tape was removed, and the piece was test fit again to see if it was along the lines of what I wanted. It was.
Small holes were punched in the flanges I had purposely created for plug welding to the two side filler panels it was next to get. The rough cut versions of these were similarly mocked up. Note the notches for the wheelwells hadn't even been made as of yet in this pic.
After a little trimming and refining...
...they were a little closer to the final shape but still had a ways to go.
The blue masking tape strips had outlined where the center depression needed to be to match the emblem. It was removed, 'cause it was time to add this detail next. Unable to stamp and stretch the needed shape into the metal, the exact centerline was found, then a cut was made directly down it. The desired depth was decided upon, and marked out as a flange on each side of the cut. From there, the two flanges were created by bending on the lines that determined the depth. This gave me the width and the depth of the center feature, but not the back. The back portion was created by bending up a simple 5 sided box that fit exactly around the outside of the two inner flanges on the main piece. The box portion was then welded to the backside of the main piece. Confused yet? It turned out like this:
From there, the whole assembly was once more test fit inside the car, but this time with more attention and bead rolled features added to the side filler panels.
If you look closely, in some of the pics, you can see that a 90 degree bend was made at the top, with the thought being that it would cover up the sheetmetal portion of the rear package tray (and its many holes) and give me an area to weld the top of the assembly in to as well. This was one of those "sounds good in theory" ideas, but was soon to change.
It's at this point that I need to stop and change gears here slightly. There was more than just the desire to eliminate the rear seat that drove this particular modification. Remember waaay back to when I covered the plumbing of the air and brake lines on the car? I had chosen to mount them partially on the front side of the rear frame crossmember, and when it came time to test fit the body on the car, everything cleared ok, but it had left me with no room to access any of the fasteners that held the tubing in place, never mind being able to get a tool in there!
So how this pertains to the rear firewall, when the firewall was created, it was moved ahead roughly 4 !/2" at the floor, and around 3" at the top package tray area resulting in the nice "slant" to it you see in the pics. This purposely also reduced the size of the "dead" area between the front seat backs and the rear firewall. Voila, 2 birds with one stone.🙂
Ok, phew! Now, anyone that's been fooling with cars for a while, knows that making modifications to anything the factory created is much like pulling a loose thread on a sock. This is what I've come to call my "Sock Thread Theory".
Lol
It goes something like this:
You think that pulling on that loose thread at the cuff of your sock is going to just affect the others directly around it before it breaks. However, more often than not, it will cause completely different threads to bunch up somewhere completely unexpected. Like waaay down there at the toe. That's because all the threads in the sock are all intertwined with each other, and pulling one affects ALL others around it.
The same principle applies to making modifications to cars. One modification here affects several other things you didn't immediately think about over there. This particular modification of mine is a prime example of this phenomenon.
Mounting tubing to the crossmember affected access to the fasteners. Moving the rear firewall forward to counter this then affected the distance it sat from the trunk floor, creating a gap.
And so it goes...
Oh, And btw, before I get swamped with "well why didn't you just move and bend up more tubing..." comments, I had spent roughly $400 in bulk stainless steel tubing in various sizes, roughly around another $150-200 dollars in misc fittings and about 3 solid months of my time creating all the various special bends and making it all look as perfect as I could, so I wasn't about to turn my back on all that and start over again. That was a non-negotiable point for me.
So, on to the trunk floor.
Now that I had a sizeable gap inbetween the newly created rear firewall and the existing kick-up portion of the trunk floor, it was time to assess this area next before the rear firewall could be finished. The area of the trunk floor in question was a nightmare of a piece to try and reproduce even with all my metal shaping tools and newfound experience at the ready, so I got to scrutinizing the whole area and developed a game plan.
The decision was made to fabricate and replace the entire kicked-up section of the trunk floor. Now, before you go and think I've gone completely off my rocker, hear me out. There were several factors that lead to this decision.
1) I now had an ugly gap to fill between the rear firewall and the existing trunk floor.
2) My Cutlass has the body cushions in the area above the rear crossmember, and the sheetmetal mounts that sit on them supporting the body were starting to rust out. Easiest way to repair/replace them was with the trunk floor removed.
3) You may recall I added QA1 anti-lift bars to the rear suspension. These mount between the upper cast-in ears of the differential and raise the actual mounting point of the upper control arms. While these are a worthy upgrade to change the car's instant center and apply more leverage on the tire increasing traction, they were never designed to be used on an air ride equipped vehicle. I found that they had the negative effect of causing the upper control arms to just touch the underside of the trunk floor kick-up when it was aired down. Rather than not use them, I decided instead to RAISE the trunk floor with an additional bit extra in case the arms got longer if I needed to adjust their length.
So, the most logical spot to separate the kicked-up section of the trunk floor from the rest of the trunk floor was found at a factory spot welded seam in the transition area between the two. The spot welds were drilled out along here, and in the areas where it attached to the inner wheelwells. Here the section has been removed.
Once removed, string lines were laid out at the new desired raised height, and verified for level.
With this done, The rear firewall was reinstalled, and a lazer level was used to project a line on the back where the trunk floor would intersect it. This line was transferred onto the firewall with a Sharpie, and the firewall was removed from the car. Since cardboard is much cheaper and easier to use than steel, a cardboard template was made to match the complex shape of the back of the firewall.
This exact pattern and shape was then transferred directly to the newly created piece of sheetmetal that would become the new section of trunk floor. Note the purposeful tabs that bend under to provide something to weld to...
This ^^^ is the view from the underside. The following pic shows how perfectly it mates with the backside of the firewall from the top.
Work commenced on creating the rest of the new section of the trunk floor with bead rolled details that resembled the factory ones to add detail and strength to the flat panel. A rough test fit, not yet levelled:
You may have noticed the recessed section of the new floor in the foreground. This is where the stainless steel bulkhead connectors mount connecting the flexible discharge lines from the air management system to the hard lines underneath. The plan was always to mount the AccuAir air management system in this area of the trunk, and when the stainless lines were bent underneath the car, they were created to mate with the height of the stock trunk floor. Rather than reinvent the wheel, I simply left this area at that height, and raised the rest of the floor. This had the pleasant side effect of creating an additional pleasing detail for the eye.
Once I was happy with the way things were fitting and looking, it was time to turn my attention to the underside to create new mounts for supporting the body at the body cushion locations, as well as creating some sort of flange that could attach the new floor back to the sides of the wheelwells.
Through a lengthy trial and error process, two 90 degree bent "side rails" were created with a shrinker/stretcher. I didn't own one of these prior to this modification, but it proved to be a worthwhile investment that paid for itself on this area of the project alone. Simply put, creating these without one would be impossible. These flanges that mate up to the sides of the wheelwells curve in two different directions in two different planes. They curve to match the shape of the wheelwells (as when viewed from above), but they also curve inwards as the width of the wheelwell decreases as it moves up. VERY difficult pieces to re-create. Once they were made tho, they were spot welded to the underside of the trunk floor and joined with the matching spot welding flanges at the back of the firewall. This created a small corner where the two met, and where the location of the body cushion supports needed to go in.
Once this corner was established, the inside was sprayed with weld-thru primer for corrosion protection after they're enclosed, and work was begun on creating the new body cushion support mounts. After matching to the shape of the corners and the location of the mounts, pieces were created and beadrolled with "cascading style" beads for the ultimate in strength and a pretty cool appearance. This is how they began to take shape:
Once both were created, they were welded in place in the corners and finish ground.
With this done, The rear firewall was reinstalled, and a lazer level was used to project a line on the back where the trunk floor would intersect it. This line was transferred onto the firewall with a Sharpie, and the firewall was removed from the car. Since cardboard is much cheaper and easier to use than steel, a cardboard template was made to match the complex shape of the back of the firewall.
This exact pattern and shape was then transferred directly to the newly created piece of sheetmetal that would become the new section of trunk floor. Note the purposeful tabs that bend under to provide something to weld to...
This ^^^ is the view from the underside. The following pic shows how perfectly it mates with the backside of the firewall from the top.
Work commenced on creating the rest of the new section of the trunk floor with bead rolled details that resembled the factory ones to add detail and strength to the flat panel. A rough test fit, not yet levelled:
You may have noticed the recessed section of the new floor in the foreground. This is where the stainless steel bulkhead connectors mount connecting the flexible discharge lines from the air management system to the hard lines underneath. The plan was always to mount the AccuAir air management system in this area of the trunk, and when the stainless lines were bent underneath the car, they were created to mate with the height of the stock trunk floor. Rather than reinvent the wheel, I simply left this area at that height, and raised the rest of the floor. This had the pleasant side effect of creating an additional pleasing detail for the eye.
Once I was happy with the way things were fitting and looking, it was time to turn my attention to the underside to create new mounts for supporting the body at the body cushion locations, as well as creating some sort of flange that could attach the new floor back to the sides of the wheelwells.
Through a lengthy trial and error process, two 90 degree bent "side rails" were created with a shrinker/stretcher. I didn't own one of these prior to this modification, but it proved to be a worthwhile investment that paid for itself on this area of the project alone. Simply put, creating these without one would be impossible. These flanges that mate up to the sides of the wheelwells curve in two different directions in two different planes. They curve to match the shape of the wheelwells (as when viewed from above), but they also curve inwards as the width of the wheelwell decreases as it moves up. VERY difficult pieces to re-create. Once they were made tho, they were spot welded to the underside of the trunk floor and joined with the matching spot welding flanges at the back of the firewall. This created a small corner where the two met, and where the location of the body cushion supports needed to go in.
Once this corner was established, the inside was sprayed with weld-thru primer for corrosion protection after they're enclosed, and work was begun on creating the new body cushion support mounts. After matching to the shape of the corners and the location of the mounts, pieces were created and beadrolled with "cascading style" beads for the ultimate in strength and a pretty cool appearance. This is how they began to take shape:
Once both were created, they were welded in place in the corners and finish ground.
You may notice small details like the hole in the center for accessing the drain for the air tank, the stepped flange that will underlap the existing trunk floor, and even the mounting holes for the air management system. Great pains were taken so as not to overlook any detail. Nothing worse than having to drill holes in your newly painted part 'cause you forgot that thing that was gonna mount there!
After all the heavy thinking, head scratching and fabrication time was finally done and the fitment was achieved, it was finally time to get it into epoxy primer for long term flash rust prevention until it comes time to paint it. It was epoxy primed, then sanded. Next came time for applying seam sealer to all the seams. 1/8" strips of masking tape were first laid down adjacent to the seam, then followed by 3/4" strips. The 1/8' pieces were removed leaving a perfect 1/8" gap for the seam sealer to sit in. This was carried out across all the seams, and this is what it looked like prior to applying the actual seam sealer.
Then the seam sealer was applied, smoothing it out with a finger as I went...
...and before it dried, it was unmasked resulting in a nice, clean, smooth, sealed seam.
From there, the piece was re-epoxy primed, and final welding into the car could commence. Or so I thought...😱
To be continued tomorrow, with the conclusion to the trunk saga in sight. I promise!
If you've made it this far, congrats! You're to be commended for your dedication in reading my overly in-depth build descriptions!
But seriously, thanks for following along with me and my journey. We're almost caught up to date on the stuff that's already been done, so future posts after that point will be MUCH shorter and hopefully simpler as I can post at anytime and be current. Thanks for tuning in. 'Till tomorrow.
Last edited:
liquidh8
Comic Book Super Hero
Very awesome. I would have done the same thing. After all the work to the frame, and adding all the extra stuff, modifying the sheetmetal seemed like the better way to go.
The metal work looks great. The cardboard templates, I have a boatload of old Yuengling beer boxes, and others large sheets that I use for templates before I cut an metal. I also own a shrinker stretcher, and I use the crap out of that thing.
And finally the masking tape for the seam sealer, I almost always do that. On my doors, all the new seams, etc. It makes for a cleaner finish.
Thanks for the updates, I wish I lived closer to Canada to see it in person.
The metal work looks great. The cardboard templates, I have a boatload of old Yuengling beer boxes, and others large sheets that I use for templates before I cut an metal. I also own a shrinker stretcher, and I use the crap out of that thing.
And finally the masking tape for the seam sealer, I almost always do that. On my doors, all the new seams, etc. It makes for a cleaner finish.
Thanks for the updates, I wish I lived closer to Canada to see it in person.
Donovan,
As always, your work is absolutely impeccable...I'm in awe. Some people have it, and some don't. You sir,
have it....
As always, your work is absolutely impeccable...I'm in awe. Some people have it, and some don't. You sir,
have it....
Hey Donovan enjoying the new updates. I had a question for you. What gauge sheet metal are you using in your fabrication work?
View attachment 42772
View attachment 42773
View attachment 42774
View attachment 42775
You may notice small details like the hole in the center for accessing the drain for the air tank, the stepped flange that will underlap the existing trunk floor, and even the mounting holes for the air management system. Great pains were taken so as not to overlook any detail. Nothing worse than having to drill holes in your newly painted part 'cause you forgot that thing that was gonna mount there!
After all the heavy thinking, head scratching and fabrication time was finally done and the fitment was achieved, it was finally time to get it into epoxy primer for long term flash rust prevention until it comes time to paint it. It was epoxy primed, then sanded. Next came time for applying seam sealer to all the seams. 1/8" strips of masking tape were first laid down adjacent to the seam, then followed by 3/4" strips. The 1/8' pieces were removed leaving a perfect 1/8" gap for the seam sealer to sit in. This was carried out across all the seams, and this is what it looked like prior to applying the actual seam sealer.
View attachment 42776
Then the seam sealer was applied, smoothing it out with a finger as I went...
View attachment 42777
...and before it dried, it was unmasked resulting in a nice, clean, smooth, sealed seam.
View attachment 42778
View attachment 42779
From there, the piece was re-epoxy primed, and final welding into the car could commence. Or so I thought...😱
To be continued tomorrow, with the conclusion to the trunk saga in sight. I promise!
If you've made it this far, congrats! You're to be commended for your dedication in reading my overly in-depth build descriptions!
But seriously, thanks for following along with me and my journey. We're almost caught up to date on the stuff that's already been done, so future posts after that point will be MUCH shorter and hopefully simpler as I can post at anytime and be current. Thanks for tuning in. 'Till tomorrow.
Show-off. How am I supposed to build a car to compete with yours when you are hording all the tools? That's it. I'm moving into your garage.
