Details of how to install a Hollow 36mm Front Sway Bar on a G-body

[Longroof79]

I drilled and tapped my front sway bar bushing shells for grease fittings, and drilled a hole thru the sway bar bushings that lined up with the grease fittings. Works like a charm and was basically free

Great idea! Simple and yet effective....

 

[81cutlass]

Local guy that was big into autoxing his LS monte bought the entire ridetech (the $5k kit) and he commented that his car would lift the rear inside tire on hard turns so he totally removed the rear bar. If I bought a 5 thousand dollar kit and it picked up the tires on turns I would be pretty mad but thats besides the point.

Another semi local guy also said he pulled the rear links on the rear bar when he autocrossed his g body because it let the car roll more and transfer weight onto the front which resulted in less understeer.

I can attest that my car does moderately understeer but i had stock UCA's and LCA's and an alignment done with a framing square, a tapemeasure, some string and some trig the night before the race so I'm not much of a datapoint.

I'm not sure either of those options is right and they seem like more of a band aid to the problem. I agree that there is a substantial crowd that believes removing the rear swaybar somehow benefits autocross and I can understand how it impacts it but I am not sure it is the best solution. They MIGHT be suspect to over rate rear bars from whatever kit they order. The kit doesn't have to work, it just has to sell.

And I am getting totally off track from the 36mm bar install.

 

[scoti]

Any of the Axle/Body mount Non-G-body Factory bars that can be made to fit are an improvement over any of the LCA mounted G-body Factory bars, but its easy to just order a new one. Nobody sells a new, Hollow 36mm Front bar.

QA1 sells a 1 3/8 hollow bar w/bushings for a g-body (that's 35mm vs. 36). I'm going that route as I can get free shipping through Summit.

 

[motorheadmike]

I've posted this video a lot over the years. But, this is a 36mm bar at work:

Moog Problem Solver urethane bushings and Energy Suspension urethane endlinks. It was definitely not a bolt on, and if I remember correctly it had fender washers or plates under the bushing/bracket as spacers. This is a B-body suspension/brake kit with cut 5664s up front. The rear of the car should have had a Hellwig Pro-Touring bar out back at the time this video was taken (it was ground breaking, and replaced an ATR bar).

 

[scoti]

I've posted this video a lot over the years. But, this is a 36mm bar at work:

Moog Problem Solver urethane bushings and Energy Suspension urethane endlinks. It was definitely not a bolt on, and if I remember correctly it had fender washers or plates under the bushing/bracket as spacers. This is a B-body suspension/brake kit with cut 5664s up front. The rear of the car should have had a Hellwig Pro-Touring bar out back at the time this video was taken (it was ground breaking, and replaced an ATR bar).

I have the Hellwig adjustable rear bar on my list but have pulled the trigger yet as I'm acquiring parts slowly.

 

[UNGN]

I wouldn't *not* trust Herb Adams but suspension parts have changed a bit since the 70's and each platform reacts differently. His statement was "g-bodies with rear swaybars push like dump trucks". The friend who autocrossed his SS is pretty well involved with autocrossing, you might even be familiar with him if you are into that scene as well. Doesn't mean he knows everything and it's all about parts working together, for someone a big rear bar might help greatly while the other car and totally different parts does not. I also recall Mark from SC&C stating something that a rear bar isn't always necessary, depending. I didn't run one on my SS for probably 10+ years, stuck a stock g-body one on with the last set of new LCA's, was planning on a Ridetech bar but re-thinking that.

Here is the link Cory sent me of his issue at the time (Lance Hamiltons SS):

That is a cool video, but that is a coilover car and not stock location springs and its it a bad idea to take data from a coil spring car and apply it to a stock location spring car. With a Coilover car, you can vary the spring rate and put what ever works best. A stock location rear spring car more than likely won't respond the same If my car was doing that I would go up on the front spring rate.

It appears the result of the video was he went with a LCA mounted bar, which is what I said that those work better in a parking lot, where real world bumps don't happen mid corner. He has way heavier springs/different geometry than stock, so a smaller bar works better for hi set up.

 

[PBGBodyFan]

Local guy that was big into autoxing his LS monte bought the entire ridetech (the $5k kit) and he commented that his car would lift the rear inside tire on hard turns so he totally removed the rear bar. If I bought a 5 thousand dollar kit and it picked up the tires on turns I would be pretty mad but thats besides the point.

Another semi local guy also said he pulled the rear links on the rear bar when he autocrossed his g body because it let the car roll more and transfer weight onto the front which resulted in less understeer.

I can attest that my car does moderately understeer but i had stock UCA's and LCA's and an alignment done with a framing square, a tapemeasure, some string and some trig the night before the race so I'm not much of a datapoint.

I'm not sure either of those options is right and they seem like more of a band aid to the problem. I agree that there is a substantial crowd that believes removing the rear swaybar somehow benefits autocross and I can understand how it impacts it but I am not sure it is the best solution. They MIGHT be suspect to over rate rear bars from whatever kit they order. The kit doesn't have to work, it just has to sell.

And I am getting totally off track from the 36mm bar install.

That is one of Cory’s auto-x buddies, I heard his frame cracked and he has a new body/frame(?).

He(Cory) said his rear spring rate is I believe 325 lbs, so yes, comparing coilovers to springs/shocks isn’t necessarily apples to apples. Does make a case for using that axle mounted bar money towards coilovers though. I’m pretty well set on the spring/shock setup but when I updated my rear mods from the early/mid 00’s a few years ago I kind of wish I just did the coilovers.

Part of the fun is seeing what works best and making your parts play well with one another.

I don’t intend to autocross but probaly owe it to myself to take my SS at some point, or any of the cars just for the experience.

 

[ssn696]

I'm impressed that the undercar camera stayed in place throughout the comparo runs!

 

[el camino ss 84]

if you cant find a used 36mm front sway bar. addco suspension has 36mm and also 40mm sway bars in the camaro section. instead of using factory bushing brackets and making them work. the energy suspensions ones work the best plus have grease fittings also and new bolts.

 

[scoti]

That is one of Cory’s auto-x buddies, I heard his frame cracked and he has a new body/frame(?).

He(Cory) said his rear spring rate is I believe 325 lbs, so yes, comparing coilovers to springs/shocks isn’t necessarily apples to apples. Does make a case for using that axle mounted bar money towards coilovers though. I’m pretty well set on the spring/shock setup but when I updated my rear mods from the early/mid 00’s a few years ago I kind of wish I just did the coilovers.

Part of the fun is seeing what works best and making your parts play well with one another.

I don’t intend to autocross but probaly owe it to myself to take my SS at some point, or any of the cars just for the experience.

I follow Lance & have not heard details of frame cracking or replacement (?). He did recently damage the 383 & had to freshen things up. He's constantly working to improve his skills as well as parts & tuning for the tracks he hits. One of my favorite builds.

if you cant find a used 36mm front sway bar. addco suspension has 36mm and also 40mm sway bars in the camaro section. instead of using factory bushing brackets and making them work. the energy suspensions ones work the best plus have grease fittings also and new bolts.

Are those Addco bars hollow or solid? When I was looking for a new/aftermarket bar I was searching specifically for 'hollow' bars & don't recall Addco showing anything.
I wound up purchasing a used 36mm bar from the classifieds here & plan to use the Energy Suspension mounting kit. $45 for greaseable Poly frame bushings that won't require spacers & new poly end-links as well. That's not too much & saves having to tweak the frame housings + do spacers.