It's a good day for the Gbody community

[pontiacgp]

I'm still wondering how he's going to get around not buying a licence...

"GM brands are as widely known as their automobiles, and their brand equity has generated a highly lucrative sideline business through the licensing of GM trademarks. Envision the Chevy "bowtie" or the Cadillac "crest" on all sorts of items from shirts to keychains.GM car body designs are also trademarks. Every diecast collector vehicle or Happy Meal toy that mimics a GM body is a licensed product. GM's licensing program is the world's largest, generating more $3.4 billion in end retail sales from licensed products,"


http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-corv ... or-gm.html

 

[GP403]

I'm still wondering how he's going to get around not buying a licence...

"GM brands are as widely known as their automobiles, and their brand equity has generated a highly lucrative sideline business through the licensing of GM trademarks. Envision the Chevy "bowtie" or the Cadillac "crest" on all sorts of items from shirts to keychains.GM car body designs are also trademarks. Every diecast collector vehicle or Happy Meal toy that mimics a GM body is a licensed product. GM's licensing program is the world's largest, generating more $3.4 billion in end retail sales from licensed products,"


http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-corv ... or-gm.html

I dunno if that really applies to the parts situation. The patents (if any) on these particular parts would have expired already. The trademark issue is entirely separate. Not sure how a body design can be trademarked, but I wonder if that applies to the individual parts? I imagine somebody further up the line where tobyp is at probably already thought of this (I hope!)

 

[Bweavy]

This isn't the Polio Vaccine being invented folks! Nobody's name will go down in the history books with that lighted top-plate.

These g-bodies have been around long enough that there probably aren't any original ideas left. I saw a regular Cutlass at a car show in the early 90s with lightning rods . . . one cool thing about it was the owner used some kind of homemade back-lit top plate, even though it looked crappy.

And as for the stock parts being made, the only reason anyone would get mad is because this would cut into their bottom line. After parts are mass-produced for our G-Bodies, there will be less of a market for original NOS parts. Very few people will care if the window sweeps with reveal molding on an Olds are NOS or re-pro. The guys who hoarded the NOS and are selling them on eBay and such will be less likely to command $150 for a pair of amber turn signals if they are made available aftermarket.

I think this about sums it up. We sold only GM seals until GM went crazy thru the roof & had to hunt down who was making the best possible aftermarket parts. When we couldn't find it we built it. I was a GM only guy until I saw people who loved their cars & reminded me of myself when I was younger. They couldn't afford $350 for GM hard top seals but didn't want $58.00 sets of junk either they wanted to do it once.
I had a 67 GTO when I was 17. I needed some rear trim & was making $3.35 an hour back then. I found the 2 pieces I needed used for $45.00. I had $41.00 on me. The guy gave them to me for $40.00 & said pass the favor on in the future. I have done that alot.
What a lot of you are missing is what I see daily.
You have your top end guys who need & want GM only & do not care.
You have your middle of the road who want quality parts & try to support their family & are on a budget. They will spend the $ to do it right once but can't afford GM prices & will not if the quality is there.
Then you have the guys who are barely making it & will use a used piece just to get them by until they can afford the right parts.

Mike I bought a set of GM NOS lightning rods from you for $1200. You made $ on this. There will always be guys like me that buy these parts. I in turn will pass on that Old favor so that some one else who can't afford $1200 can enjoy these as well.
I truly do not think you are the only person who ever thought of illuminating a plaque emblem. Buick has been doing it for years on the Limited dash plaques.
Now I could understand you being pissed if you planned on mass producing these & your market was cut into. Trust me it has happened a lot to me. T-top reproduction parts, Inter coolers , & aluminum Radiators to name a few.
So is this the situation where you planned on making a bunch of these & marketing them? If it is then I can see why your upset Bud.

 

[Bweavy]

I'm still wondering how he's going to get around not buying a licence...

"GM brands are as widely known as their automobiles, and their brand equity has generated a highly lucrative sideline business through the licensing of GM trademarks. Envision the Chevy "bowtie" or the Cadillac "crest" on all sorts of items from shirts to keychains.GM car body designs are also trademarks. Every diecast collector vehicle or Happy Meal toy that mimics a GM body is a licensed product. GM's licensing program is the world's largest, generating more $3.4 billion in end retail sales from licensed products,"


http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-corv ... or-gm.html

I dunno if that really applies to the parts situation. The patents (if any) on these particular parts would have expired already. The trademark issue is entirely separate. Not sure how a body design can be trademarked, but I wonder if that applies to the individual parts? I imagine somebody further up the line where tobyp is at probably already thought of this (I hope!)

I am already on a lot of these items. certain thing are obvious. You don't see any one reproducing 87-93 Mustang Front & rear covers due to the words MUSTANG which would have to be licensed. There is a lot to this & there are different manufacturers who are already licensed for emblems & other parts.

I already found the original tooling for the 83-84 H/O emblems. We can easily get the Hurst licensed of course, & GM restoration licensed. Then the problem begins with this size investment Hurst will have to go to people on ebay who are not licensed & they get shut down. They get a comission off of every emblem sold & want to protect this. No different then GM.
Certain items you will already see out there that are licensed & not licensed like marker lights. They do not have to be. Some companies do this just to command more $. What I have been seeing is a lot of incorrect stickers being licensed & they are not correct. This is a whole other subject that bothers me.

 

[pontiacgp]

GM is getting real nasty on trademark issues so I wouldn't want to see you have to go against their deep pockets.

 

[Bweavy]

GM is getting real nasty on trademark issues so I wouldn't want to see you have to go against their deep pockets.

That is why I have spoken to others like Jon at key parts, Dennis Kirban at KPP, Lloyd at Brite Ideas, etc & got my ducks in a row. All have licensed a lot of parts. They gave me the direction by contacting GM's lawyers on what we have to do & what we do not have to do.

Trust me GM came after us years ago. We obliged & removed certain items that were not licensed. Mostly dumb things Like Key chains.

 

[pontiacgp]

That's good to hear cause I wouldn't want to see your investment end up in someone else's pocket. I mentioned this before to tobyp but it appeared he thought there was no need for a licence.

 

[Bweavy]

Toby's company produces parts that would not have to be GM licensed. There are people that license some of the things they do but it isn't necessary.
But I am not Toby's company. Some of the things I want to do will have to be licensed. This is why I have done my investigating, research, & due dilligence. I mentioned The H/O emblem in a previous post. $350.00 for an header panel emblem on ebay. I wasn't impressed. We found the original manufacturer & the tooling in the U.S. It will not be $350.00 for a Header panel emblem for the guy trying to save an 83 H/O will be able to do so reasonably. We are also laying The $ out to get the tooling brought back to life. Here are some 84 Interior emblems they had laying around from back in the day.

 

[88hurstolds]

Mike I bought a set of GM NOS lightning rods from you for $1200. You made $ on this. There will always be guys like me that buy these parts. I in turn will pass on that Old favor so that some one else who can't afford $1200 can enjoy these as well.
I truly do not think you are the only person who ever thought of illuminating a plaque emblem. Buick has been doing it for years on the Limited dash plaques.
Now I could understand you being pissed if you planned on mass producing these & your market was cut into. Trust me it has happened a lot to me. T-top reproduction parts, Inter coolers , & aluminum Radiators to name a few.
So is this the situation where you planned on making a bunch of these & marketing them? If it is then I can see why your upset Bud.

Brian it's not.
This is what PISSED me off:

I had a cool idea of having the Lighting Rods name in transparent ABS with ambient lighting making the words glow.

A few weeks right after I had a DETAILED thread with plans and EVEN MENTIONED USING ABS.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=37008&p=314422#p314422

Why not PC, Acrylic, PVC or HDPE?

I don't care if other's had the idea and I'm not saying I'm the one who came up with it either.
Maybe you did have an idea as well, God only knows, just stinks high to hell that's all... what if you were in my shoes and saw this?
It also makes people in this hobby feel THREATENED to post any unique and cool ideas on this website or any other for that matter in fears that it will soon be in everyones car.
I can care less about the reproduction GM parts... have at it, I want to see these cars restored, if you don't make them someone else will but why not leave the unique items to the hobbiests.

Also Toby making threats towards us to withdraw posts and some sayin that I should be helping the cause and working with you guys in this thread is also bullshit.
You're the ones doing this full time making tons of money and already have the parts and resources to do it. The parts will be made no matter what and that's NOT what this is about.
Toby started pointing the finger at you saying you had the idea and now you're bringing up a private transaction between us in defense?
Why would you even bring that up?
No one made you buy it from me and so what if I made any money on it, I bought that MANY years ago when there were still a few around, it's an extremely rare item that is basically non-existant.
Yes people like you can afford it but don't go saying you're gonna help others because of it when you bought that shifter so you can reproduce it and make money.
I'm not in the reproduction buisness, I have a real career for income and have HEAVELY INVESTED lots of my hard earned money to achieve what I've done so far with my hobby.
I'm not here to make tons of money selling items, I enjoy this as a hobby and was thinking of making something unique and selling a FEW for others to enjoy and still have some uniqueness.
But now it's gonna be in just about everyone's car, how would you feel if you were in my shoes?
I'm not the only one that's angry about this either, I'm just not afraid to speak my mind... that's all.
Do what you want... I'm done here. 🙁

 

[Bweavy]

Mike this is why I asked what pissed you off.

The reason I brought up our transaction is that my explanation of the different levels of buyers. After re-reading your right I should of posted you paid X & I paid Y. That was a transaction between us & should have stayed that way.

After reading your post I understand because your saying he wanted to use the exact same material. This is why you took it personal.

You both have strong personalities & I'll leave it at that. So when he makes a threat you have to keep in mind he is a person as well. This being a person comes with ego's, knowledge, & can get his feeling hurt like any one else.

Like you said he could threaten to yank the whole Gbody program, It wouldn't matter there would be others lined up doing this. Trust me this is a bell that can not be un rung. I have spoke with other vendors who were already starting to do things we have done. Me being me I let them know hey we are 90 days or less on this why not focus your $ here or there because we haven't started that.

Mike what we would get is a company who deals with the older muscle cars & would not give 2 craps about the quality of parts. That is not what we have here. We are lucky to have a company who wants to set the bar hi enough yet keep the prices reasonable.
I'll just put this out there for you both to think about. Is it possible you both have huge ego's & do not want to get out done by the other? If you were both at a bar & didn't know each other & pulled up at the same time in an Olds do you think you would set down & talk?
You both got off on the wrong foot a while ago & you both know what I am talking about. Bury that hatchet start over & do what is best for the communitty not your egos.

Pissed both of you off? Yeah that is what I do 😉 Think about what I said. Not for you each persoanlly but would benefit yourself & others. Mike you really want to build a limited run & get an exclusive on this part? You have the person who could be your ally not your competitor. Start fresh like men. How's that for speaking your Mind?

No you can PM or e-mail each other you have something in Common that you both think I am an *ss. :lol: