New dual exhaust/emissions questions

[RegMan79]

I want the true duel set up for performance purposes. I never really thought about a high flow single. I guess they're not to crazy on inspection here from what I read.

If I went with this kit and got new cats. You guys think I'd be easy to stuff them in the kit some how? I see the After market Xmember on jegs too.

 

[565bbchevy]

If you are looking for some sort of direct fit true duals with dual cats you won't find anything that does not require some sort of fabricating and welding.

 

[clean8485]

I'm just curious about what kind of performance advantage you're trying to achieve, that you feel that you need to have a true dual exhaust system on your car. Do you have a high performance engine in the car now, or are you planning on installing a high performance engine in the future? Unless you have an engine that requires a really free flowing exhaust system, then there's probably not much advantage between a good high flow single system and a true dual system.

 

[RegMan79]

If you are looking for some sort of direct fit true duals with dual cats you won't find anything that does not require some sort of fabricating and welding.

Yeah, after looking for a while I'm definitely beliving that.

 

[RegMan79]

I'm just curious about what kind of performance advantage you're trying to achieve, that you feel that you need to have a true dual exhaust system on your car. Do you have a high performance engine in the car now, or are you planning on installing a high performance engine in the future? Unless you have an engine that requires a really free flowing exhaust system, then there's probably not much advantage between a good high flow single system and a true dual system.

Yeah I'm planning on getting a higher performance engine. I'm also hoping to wake up this 305 a little too. It worked on my old camaro, so hoping for simular results.

 

[montec]

In the US, non factory dual exhausts are illegal in all 50 states, even with dual cats thanks to the 1990 clean air act. If your model of vehicle had dual exhaust as a factory option for the model of engine in the vehicle, then it is ok to install dual exhaust. As stated by others above, G bodies were never certified for dual exhaust, making them illegal. I don't know about your state, but with NJ inspections, they drive the car over a camera so they can easily inspect the exhaust on a video monitor.

Since when. There is a huge market for dual exhaust, and many manufactures are meeting compliance and some are even certified for cali. Now without cats they do state for off road use only but there are kits and companies that offer true duals on cars that never came with the option and are legal for on road use.

Now I don't live in a state with inspections, so maybe the state you live in that is the law. For me the epa can shove it up where their sun don't shine, as I meet tail pipe emissions without the mandated crap.

 

[Clone TIE Pilot]

Since when. There is a huge market for dual exhaust, and many manufactures are meeting compliance and some are even certified for cali. Now without cats they do state for off road use only but there are kits and companies that offer true duals on cars that never came with the option and are legal for on road use.

Now I don't live in a state with inspections, so maybe the state you live in that is the law. For me the epa can shove it up where their sun don't shine, as I meet tail pipe emissions without the mandated crap.

Since Nov 15th, 1990 when Bush senior signed the stricter amendment for the federal clean air act. It has been this way over a quarter of a century already.

"
Question 7 ,
Is it tampering to install a dual exhaust system on a vehicle
originally equipped with a single exhaust?

Answer 7. Yes. The general rule is that a motor vehicle
emission control system (which includes the exhaust
configuration) may not be changed from an EPA certified
configuration without subjecting the repair shop to liability for
violating the federal tampering prohibition.
configuration, including the location of the converters, and
exhaust pipe diameter and length, are items specified by the
manufacturer because engines and some of th% associated emissions
systems are generally affected by the exhaust system
The exhaust system backpressure, which subsequently affects vehicle emissions. The
installation of a dual exhaust system with hyo converters would,
therefore, be considered tampering. The Agency will not, however,
require a repair shop to restore a vehicle which has a non-stock
dual exhaust system to a single exhaust configuration. A shop -
may, therefore, replace sections of pipes on such a system,
except for that portion of the pipes where the original catalytic
converter would have been located. It would not be considered
tampering to install a dual exhaust system with tvo converters if
the vehicle manufacturer certified an identical engine-chassis
configuration for the vehicle model year or newer that includes
such an exhaust configuration. It is also illegal for the vehicle owner to install a dual exhaust
into a vehicle originally equipped with a single exhaust


Under federal law, catalytic converters may not be removed
and replaced with "converter replacement pipes' by any person.
The 1990 Clean Air Act Amendments even prohibit private
individuals from installing "converter replacement pipes" on their
own vehicles. Anyone who installs such pipes would violate section
203(a)(3)(A) and (B) of the Clean Air Act (Act).

Section 203(a)(3)(8) makes it illegal for any
person to sell or to install any part where a principal effect would
be to bypass, defeat, or render inoperative any device or element of
design of a vehicle's emission control system.

Basically, you are not allowed to alter the cat, such as moving it to a non stock location or adding a second one as it affects operation. Dual cats run cooler, and don't clean the exhaust as well if you use two cats designed for cleaning single exhausts. Moving a cat further back on the exhaust can cause it to run cooler and not work as well.

Now some of these aftermarket manufactures probably sent their dual cat exhaust systems through CARB and full Federal Test Procedure (FTP) to certify their systems as being compliant and use cats designed for dual use. These tests to get approval and E.O. numbers cost $2,000 to perform. As far as I know, nobody makes a legal dual exhaust for G bodies. Tampering with your exhaust is a $2,500 fine nation wide in all 50 states under federal law. Fed > state.

 

[pontiacgp]

Vehicle emission testing comes under state law. Each state is different with California being the worst

http://traffic.findlaw.com/drivers-license-vehicle-info/state-emissions-standards-and-testing.html

in Texas....

Pro Exhaust - Laws on exhaust and emission systems
Exhaust Systems
The exhaust system includes the manifolds, gaskets, exhaust tubing, mufflers, resonators, tailpiping, and supporting hardware. On vehicles manufactured before 1984, the catalytic converters are considered part of the exhaust system only, and not part of the emissions system. Laws and state inspection criteria differ between what is considered exhaust system only and what is considered the emissions system. In short, on vehicles manufactured before 1984 the catalytic converter (if the vehicle was originally manufactured with a catalytic converter then it must have one) will only be inspected visually for cracks or leaks as part of the exhaust system (1984 was the year catalytic converters were required to be standard equipment. Prior to 1984 some manufacturers delivered vehicles with catalytic converters, some did not).

There are also Federal (EPA) laws governing exhaust and emissions systems, as well as county and city rules that may apply.

Some important notes to remember on Texas laws governing exhaust systems are:

1. Texas state inspectors inspect the exhaust system for holes, leaking seams, or patches on the muffler, resonators, exhaust pipe, tailpipe, or catalytic converter.
2. Every motor vehicle shall at all times be equipped with muffler in good working order and in constant operation.
3. The tailpipe should discharge the exhaust at the rear or sides of the "passenger compartment", and not be in a position where exhaust gases could penetrate inside the passenger compartment. Some pickups are equipped with a camper or hard shell cover, this truck modification will be considered as a passenger compartment. The entire structure of a motor home-type vehicle is considered a passenger compartment.
4. Dual exhaust systems may be modified to single exhaust systems and single exhaust systems to dual exhaust systems, provided the modification does not violate requirements concerning exhaust emission systems.
5. State inspectors do not check how loud your exhaust system is, only that it is present, in good condition, and functioning. However, some cities and counties in Texas have ordinances against "loud" exhaust and you could be pulled over, maybe even ticketed. See "Noise and volume" below for more on loud exhaust.

 

[Streetbu]

The law from what I understand is however many cats the car had originally it must maintain, AND in the the stock location. Other modifications are allowed to the exhaust as long as it passes emissions .

 

[montec]

As for fed grater then state you should go back and reread the 10th amendment. Now as for putting duals on do as you need to, and abide by the laws you can. Shops in my state will do custom dual exhaust with cats, no one will install without. But then again we don't need all these nanny state laws as well.