big block vs small block
- Thread starter fatso86
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dogshit said:
i can respect what a big cubic inch engine has to offer. building a "street car" is a very loose term, and though most peoples depiction of a street car is a highway friendly car that can be used all the time, when i think street car, i think of a car that doesnt neccesarily have all the creature comforts, but can be tolerated every once in a while. personally, i consider a 300-400hp car that gets 15-20 mpg more of a cruiser than a street car. Not to say that it can't be a fast car, but it's compromised more to be driven further distances than to blast down an industrial road next to someone else. when i think street car, i think of a much rowdier (not neccasarily the engine) car that probably lacks an overdrive, has a loose non-lockup converter and steeper gears. pretty much all the stuff that you more or less can't have with a car that you wanted to drive more than 40-50 miles at a time. I am probably a lot younger than most people on this forum, and i'm told all the time from people that have been driving modified cars a lot longer than i have that one day i'll get tired of driving around at 50 mph with the tach at 3400 rpm. but for now, i think its cool and don't mind tolerating a car that leaves harder and runs harder than someone elses similar, more "conservative" car. And who's to say a car that leaves at 7000 rpm isnt a street car? i know its an extreme situation, but have you ever seen larry larsons 6 sec nova from last years drag week? they drove the car over 1,000 miles with no failures, and went 6.90's @ over 200mph.
Well first off you're not leaving at 7,000 rpm if you had a stall converter that would let you do that the car would be intolerable to drive on the street. And the argument here to me is... Why do that? A big block will out power the small block at lower RPM's, and not needing as steep gearing, and a high stall converter to make good power for a strong launch. And it will last longer much longer than a high strung small block. I've only really got experience with three big blocks one in my 89 GMC 3500 dually with just a couple little tiny bolt on mods it wasn't meant to be a racer but it was still quick. My brothers Monte SS with a 454 with just an intake, carb, and headers and 3 inch exhaust was faster than balls he had this 383 vortecs and all the bells and whistles and the basically stock junk yard truck 454 in the same car was faster. And we had an 80's F350 mud truck with a 460 bored and stroked to 514 or 521 I forget but it had Cobra Jet heads, a big cam, single plain high rise manifold, a big *ss race carb on it, and headers with just glass packs with dumps that came out under the cab. And I can tell you those big blocks even the mild ones were way more fun and way more torque than a small block and I've been in, owned, and driven a lot of small block cars. I like small blocks especially with a 4 speed they're fun, but big blocks are more fun (and faster).
And I heard someone say something about nascar uses small blocks? Yeah true but you know why? because big blocks are banned. 426 hemi Superbirds and Daytona Chargers, and 427 SOHC Ford Torino Super Cobra's were breaking 200 miles an hour routinely back in the late 60's and early 70's and Nascar said enough is a enough the cars are too fast and imposed the small block rule and banned purpose built homologation aero cars. If nascar teams were allowed to run big blocks you can bet your *ss they'd be all over that like white on rice.
On the street if you launch any car hard it's gonna just spin the tires. My SBC in my firebird over powers the 255mm radial T/A's I have on it with just a stab of the throttle in first or second gear. I've never had to take it to 7000rpm I put a self imposed 6500rpm limit on the engine and I don't usually even take it up to 6000 and trying to launch it on the street is damn near impossible it's better to just roll off the launch and then get into it. The big blocks excel at that kind of environment roll on power... Don't load it up and launch just pull away then mash it. The car is fast but I'm considering going to a 400 Pontiac engine with just a little cam, intake, carb, and headers because I know it'll be a more docile car it'll probably be slower on the track but in street races (not that I do that) it will probably be faster. And I can get the motor cheap and it's only got 5,000 miles on it since it was rebuilt.
And I heard someone say something about nascar uses small blocks? Yeah true but you know why? because big blocks are banned. 426 hemi Superbirds and Daytona Chargers, and 427 SOHC Ford Torino Super Cobra's were breaking 200 miles an hour routinely back in the late 60's and early 70's and Nascar said enough is a enough the cars are too fast and imposed the small block rule and banned purpose built homologation aero cars. If nascar teams were allowed to run big blocks you can bet your *ss they'd be all over that like white on rice.
On the street if you launch any car hard it's gonna just spin the tires. My SBC in my firebird over powers the 255mm radial T/A's I have on it with just a stab of the throttle in first or second gear. I've never had to take it to 7000rpm I put a self imposed 6500rpm limit on the engine and I don't usually even take it up to 6000 and trying to launch it on the street is damn near impossible it's better to just roll off the launch and then get into it. The big blocks excel at that kind of environment roll on power... Don't load it up and launch just pull away then mash it. The car is fast but I'm considering going to a 400 Pontiac engine with just a little cam, intake, carb, and headers because I know it'll be a more docile car it'll probably be slower on the track but in street races (not that I do that) it will probably be faster. And I can get the motor cheap and it's only got 5,000 miles on it since it was rebuilt.
The engines NASCAR uses are purpose built engines. They are all 358 cui, they all have around 850 hp. There not small blocks or big blocks and are not offered outside of the sport.
kornball426 said:
out where i live, pretty much all i use my car for is racing on friday and sat nights (on the street). and no you're right, an automatic car that leaves at 7000 rpm will NEVER be seen on the street. but why not in a manual trans car? its not easy to get cars that leave that hard to hook on the street, but definitely not impossible. A well thought out suspension, frame notch and a 12.5" slick or drag radial makes it a lot easier. no argument at all that ultimately a big block will make more power, but with a limited budget, either or can go just as fast. as for your pontiac , sounds like a cool, practical swap. a set of ET street radials would probably get your car to dead hook, even with everything the converter has. going from a so-so pair of BFG drag radials to the M/T's in the same size was an unbelievable difference on my car. i could leave (on footbrake w/a 2 step) at 2800-3000 on the street with no prep no problem and was gonna switch the converter to something even a little looser, but wound up selling the engine and recently started building another one. the next converter will be on the tight side cause the cars getting big spray with this next engine, but i'm still pretty confident that we'll get it to leave more than pretty good even on spray/ DR's. as for extra wear and tear due to higher rpms, the engine that was in my car was taken apart and gone through before it was sold. It had over 250 street passes on it shifting at 6300 every time, and could've went another 250 more. the wear factor is wayyy more dependent on how the car is taken care of, and how it was put together in the first place. It's not being abused if it was built to be used that way.
i love this converstation lol. guys i dont hate the big block i love them both i was just tryin to help fatso with his budget is all lol. but i am enjoyin everybit of this arguement lol even though its a never ending battle that nither side will win. its just like chevy vs. ford or coke vs. pepsi itl never be won lol
scratch the chevy vs. ford thing the side can and has been won
Chevy > Ford its simple
scratch the chevy vs. ford thing the side can and has been won
Chevy > Ford its simple
custom442 said:
oh sorry lol i just figured it would be obvoius that i hate fords lol bein on a gm g body site lol
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